The Howie Games

00:02 A listener production. 00:10 You are listening to episode 277 of the Howie Games Part B, the first of our Millionaires Club series featuring Ange Postacoglu. On we go, Tommy. 00:21 You make the final. So, again, we come back. What was your primary school team you coached? 00:27 Paran High School. Yeah, just down the road from the two blues, the Paran VFA Club. 00:32 So you copes them as a kid, yeah? 00:35 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was 12 years old, yeah. 00:37 Right, so that was your first job. Now you're coaching against Manchester United, looking for their first silverware Tottenham, as you said, in 40 years in Bilbao in Spain. 00:50 What are your memories of the lead-up and the game? So the big night has arrived for Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United. 00:59 A competition that can save a season and change the next one. A night with double reward, a trophy, and the place in next season's Champions League. And that is what it's all about tonight. 01:11 Yeah, again, it was one of those experiences where... 01:19 You know, I've gone... Because at that stage, I'd been in Europe for four years to Celtic. It was my second year. And you're going... You know, and there's guys, you know, some fantastic coaches who've coached for a long time in Europe, never get to a final of a European competition. I'm going, what the hell am I doing here? You know, I keep thinking somebody's going to tap me on the shoulder and say, just get out of the way, you know, let the real story happen. And I was that sort of... 01:48 You know, I was really conscious of the fact that, okay, we'd gotten there and it was obviously something unbelievable for me personally, but I had to sort of put that to the side and think about the club and say, okay, the club and the supporters more than anything else. This is what they've craved. You know, I've got a real responsibility here to deliver. And, you know, I sense the nervousness in a lot of people saying, you know, during the days leading up to it who had been at the club for a very long time. 02:20 And it wasn't the usual kind of excitement about, oh, we're going to a final. It was sheer fear and trepidation that, you know, we'd been here before, even the supporters out. 02:29 We've been here before. We know the feeling, you know, the disappointment. We know what's coming. And, you know, I had to, I really insulated the players from that first of all and the staff. I kind of said, look, let's bunker down and make sure that within our sort of tone of silence that, you know, we don't let that sort of penetrate. 02:51 And I kind of really, I think they sensed in me a calm. I remember Daniel Levy, the chairman, came for breakfast the day of the game and, We just sat down and had a coffee and he said, oh, you know, everyone's really relaxed around the place. I said, yeah, you know, we've done the work, we're ready to go. And he kind of said to me, and you've got to understand, I've been in, I think he said seven or eight finals, I haven't won one of them, you know. And I said, oh. Thanks for that. Nice motivation. See you later. It's not really filling me with any confidence. But, you know, I kind of – but I knew where he was coming from because, like I said, you know, when you get so close and it's not just the feeling that you haven't won – It's, you know, you've got to go through it all again and see whether you can win it again. 03:34 And then there's the ridicule of the whole, this would have been the ultimate Spursy thing because, you know, I'd been bullish. You know, I said, well, I always win things in my second year. And then if we fumbled on the last day, it would be, you know, that Spursy tag, they would never be able to eliminate it. So, but I had a real clear-eyed focus. I had a real belief that, you know, the group, the thing about the players is we'd had a really, really tough year. 03:58 They were coming from me on a weekly basis. To be fair, I was probably lucky to survive and not get sacked at some point. 04:05 This is probably the two worst teams that have played in the European final. If you're looking at it domestically and looking at the league table, this is an opportunity for someone. This now gives you qualification for the Champions League. It's a great opportunity for the players that are there now. 04:16 We kept winning in the Europa League, which kind of kept me – but I think the players – I did 130 press conferences, I think, minimum that year. Wow. And the players saw me get up there and it was literally – I was getting battered, mate. You know, I was up against the ropes and, you know, I'd throw a few every now and then but, you know, just to – and I think the players saw me up there on a weekly basis, and I never once chucked them under the bus or chucked anyone else under the bus. I kind of took it all upon myself and – I think the players and the staff, to be fair, recognise that. 04:50 And on that day, I knew they'd pay me back, you know. I knew they'd go, you know, not pay me back, but in terms of what we've got to this place when we've been through so much that there's nothing we're going to face in this final that we can't overcome. 05:05 A little scurry here into the Manchester United box. Sar delivers the cross in towards Brendan Johnson. 05:13 It's in! 05:18 It's first blood to Tomham in the Europa League final. And it's Brennan Johnson, the leading scorer, who delivers him, Bill Bale. 05:27 And that sends the Tomham supporters wild inside the San Mammes. 05:31 And that's the way they played. It wasn't a pretty final. It was pretty ugly in the end. But I was so confident we'd win and with that group of players and the staff that we'd be able to sort of create that moment for supporters that... 05:46 you know, we'll live for them forever. 05:48 The full-time whistle, and Spurs have won the Europa League. 05:52 It's salvation for Spurs in Bilbao. And after a 17-year wait, they finally win a major trophy. They will play in the Champions League next season. It's glory, glory, Tottenham Hotspur on a wonderful night for them in northern Spain. Ange Postacoglu is a winner in his second season, and he told everybody that's what he was going to do. And Brendan Johnson... 06:15 There's three things I wanted to play for you. This is the second one. 06:18 So this is a video basically in pubs around the world of Tottenham fans watching the final. So I'm going to play a bit of it to you here. This is where it hit me, the joy you brought to people globally, Ang. 06:33 Yeah. 06:35 So this is just a selection. So I wrote it down. They're in Seoul... Pittsburgh, Bangalore, Uganda in Central Africa, Brazil, Japan, Malaysia, Vietnam. This is Tottenham fans who have been starved of joy. To describe to people what I'm showing you, it's like Fed Square when the soccer is scored, but all around the world. 07:02 It runs a minute and a half. I don't know if you've seen that. No, but I mean... It's so cool, mate. 07:09 It is. It is cool. And, you know, like I said, it's why I joined the club and why I took on that challenge because I knew how significant it would be. And to be fair, even now, you know, Tottenham supporters, when they see me, you know, they almost... 07:26 kind of asked me politely, can I give you a hug, you know, because that's what it means to them because they said, you know, I shared that with my grandfather or my grandson or my dad or my, you know, we've been going to games for, you know, with season ticket holders for the last 50 years and the last 40 years we haven't, won a European trophy the last 17 years. And it's not just, it's, you know, they've been ridiculed, mocked by opposition supporters, watching other teams win trophies and not have that feeling. So it was an incredible night. 07:56 It's a moment to cherish for everyone associated with the club. The Europa League belongs to Tottenham in 2025. Tottenham Hotspur are winners once again. 08:08 I know what it means for this football club. 08:11 Unfortunately, the longer it goes on, it's harder to break that cycle sometimes. 08:16 You know, even I've been sensing nervousness in everybody at the club because they've been in a situation before and until you get that, until you break that, sort of take that monkey off your back, you never understand what it feels like. And we've got a really young group, but I'm hoping them tasting this now and the success they have, you guys will know it feeds into itself. You know, they feel differently about themselves and mainly for the supporters because... You know, there's probably been supporters here who've been following us for those 41 years. 08:46 We haven't won one in Europe in 17, you know, and just what it means to them, it's incredible. 08:51 And even Tottenham Stadium was full and I've seen some images of Tottenham Stadium. They watch the game live in there and people are just breaking down crying and you realise what it means to them, you know, and... 09:03 It was such a great night. I had all my best mates from Melbourne had come across, you know, five, six guys that I grew up with came across. Obviously my wife was there as well and my kids. And there was a kind of celebration after the game back at the hotel and in this kind of private room and it was just sort of supposed to be family and friends of players and staff. Yeah. 09:29 We had the best night, mate. You're sitting there and we're all pitching ourselves of how this happened and realising the impact of that. I said to the players afterwards that there's no doubt that the whole thing for me was... 09:47 You know, outside the dressing rooms at our home ground were photos on the wall and I took the players into that hallway at some point during the season. I said, what do you notice about the photos? And the first thing that struck them was that, you know, they're only players and teams that have won things for the club. Most of them were in black and white. 10:09 Hmm. 10:11 I said to them at the time, I said, you know, what's important is what you don't see on those walls. And I said, you don't see Harry Kane, who's the greatest ever footballer this football club's had, because he didn't win anything at the club at the time. I said to Sonny, he was the captain. I said, Sonny, the only way you're going to get on these walls and, you know, become immortal at this football club is by winning something, you know. So I kind of painted this story to the players and And, you know, after we won it, I said, well, that's it. You've done it now. You know, you can come back to this football club in 20 years' time and your photo will be on that wall and you can walk through with your kids and show them, you know, that that's you, you know. 10:48 And so you're part of that and I'm connected to those players now and that staff and that football club forever because of that moment. And that's, like I said, that's where the gold is, mate. It's not about the success in itself. It's that moment and what that moment means. 11:08 So this is the final thing I want to play you. What did you think when you saw this? 11:15 Yeah, crazy. 11:16 It's... 11:18 Mate, I've had some bizarre bloody moments in my life, I tell you. 11:25 When do you, because this is since you've been on the show, when does someone send you a clip and say, hey, Robin Williams is singing Big Edge? 11:32 Keep your Patricino, Conte and Mourinho and even Christian Groves. 11:43 Because everywhere we go. 11:53 So, I mean, when I was a Celtic, I had Rod Stewart, he would send me a whole sort of box of Aussie wines every time we beat Rangers, right? 12:02 Would he really? 12:03 Yeah, he did. Yeah, and we did it a fair few times. So I've got boxes and boxes of Aussie wines that he would send me. He did ask for them back when I left Celtic, to be fair. No more for you. Yeah. But then, yeah, like you said, I got to Tottenham and, yeah, Robbie Williams, you know, and his songs sort of angels, they sort of started singing it to my name. And it's funny because I was at – I went to a dinner with I think it was George Kalambaras actually was over and he had some foodie mates and we went over and he invited my wife and I for dinner with his – and Robbie's partner was there actually on the night and she said – and he wasn't there and she introduced herself. 12:43 I said, oh, how are you going? She goes – And she got Robbie on the phone. And I said, G'day, mate, how are you? And I said, apologies for butchering your song, by the way. And he goes, no, it's all cool, Ange, no worries. But, yeah, it's one of these sort of bizarre things in life where you just go, you know, that's just madness. Yeah, part of me goes... 13:06 That's too far over the top. It's not kind of – I'm not comfortable in that space, but at the same time, it's pretty cool. 13:16 So 225,000 rumoured people at the parade. You had the famous line about all the best TV series season three is better than season two. That was on the 23rd of May. 13:26 And I'll tell you something. I'll leave you with this. 13:29 All the best television series season three is better than season two. 13:36 So Tottenham finished 17th. 13:41 For everyone around the world that has any understanding of sport, I don't understand English Premier League, but I can see, right, you're trying to win the trophy, so you're putting your best team out on the pitch in the Europa, and something's going to have to suffer. You've got your centre-backs, Van de Van and Romero out, Vicario, the goalies out, your strikers, Richarlison and Solanke are out. You've got injuries, so it's obvious that you are putting your eggs in the Europa basket trying to deliver this trophy. The club obviously didn't see that way. 14:12 Ange Postacoglu has been sacked by Tottenham just a fortnight after an historic win for the English club. Let's go live to Europe correspondent Jacqueline Robson with more in Jackie. That win had convinced many fans that he would actually stay. 14:33 Well, given it was their first piece of silverware in 17 years, David, many fans were willing to give Ange Postacoglu a second chance and that woeful Premier League season seemed to melt away. But clearly it wasn't enough for the power brokers of Tottenham sacking the Aussie coach two years into his four-year contract. 14:53 We talked about what happens. How do you find out? You mentioned Daniel Levy, who was a controversial figure at the football club. I'll say these words, Angie. You don't have to. But do you get a phone call? Does he call you into the office? What happened? 15:08 Yeah, look, I kind of... 15:10 Like I said, I felt like I was kind of dodging the bullet all the way through that second year because, yeah, like our league form wasn't great. And like you said, I make no apologies for that. I went all in on winning the Europa because I just felt it was just too important for the football club because it wasn't just about... Winning a trophy, which obviously was the most important thing, but it gets you to the Champions League, which means Champions League money, you know, and the club hadn't been in Champions League. And for any, you know, anyone sort of understands European football, getting into the Champions League is very, very significant. 15:41 So I'm going, you know what, I'm going all in. Now, that made a lot of people uncomfortable, made a lot of people uncomfortable outside the club, certainly made people uncomfortable inside the club. I don't think they agreed with that strategy and they made it clear they didn't agree, but... You know, unfortunately for them, unless they removed me, that was going to be the strategy because I just felt it was the best way forward. 16:04 And, you know, so I kind of knew even when we won it, you know, and I told my wife, I said, look, this will be the last game. I was convinced that they were going to get rid of me now. You know, my wife's an optimist, you know, even Frank Trimbley, the people around me were kind of, no, he can't get rid of you after winning because, you know, it's such a significant – but I kind of – I didn't get that sense, not just from him but other people around the club that – you know, who were going to be part of the decision-making process. A lot of them are still there. I never got the sense that they were, you know, they were sort of all in on me and what I was trying to do. 16:41 And it was bizarre because, like I said, you know, that night we had at Bill Bauer, they were all in that room, you know, and I could see them and there was this little part of me who'd go, you know what, I should really just go up and have a crack at them now, you know, and... 16:57 You know, I felt like you're enjoying this, but I know what you're going to do in the next sort of. So we finished and after we left we had the parade, which was an unbelievable day. It was incredible. 17:08 you know, 200,000 people in the streets and we're on the bus and I was trying to, you know, because when you have a mass of people, I was actually focusing in on the individual face because I just wanted to see what it all meant, you know, and there was kids, there was grandmas, there was like there was every person from every walk of life who was just rejoicing in that moment and, you know, I had such a great day in the parade and, again, even my speech that day, I kind of, you know, part of me wanted to be self-serving and just shoving up a few people who I knew that they were enjoying the day, but I knew what they were going to do. 17:45 But I kind of said, no, you know, I'll give... It's not right for me to spoil people's day, but I knew it was coming. So then literally the day after we left, we went to Greece with the family. I wanted to get away from it all. 17:57 And from there, I was just waiting for the phone call. I knew it was going to happen and then sort of... Major Frank said, look, Daniel Levy wants you to come back and have a meeting. He wants to have a chat to you. 18:11 And I was in Greece. I said, look, I'll get on a flight. I'll come back. And he said, you know, Daniel wants to see you. I said, look, I don't really want to see him. I said, look, what's he going to say to me? You know, I know what he's delivering. If it was good news, I would have, you know, just got on with it on my holiday. So I said, don't worry, just finish it off and we're done. Yeah. 18:29 That's how it ended. But it wasn't a shock. It was disappointing, yeah, because I felt like I'd done the hard yards and, you know, I delivered on kind of what they wanted and what everyone sort of wanted. And I felt like we could build from that because I had a playing group now that was all in, you know. They were totally – and we had Champions League football, the opportunity to bring some players in. 18:50 So, you know, I was disappointed. But at the same time, I felt like, you know, what – We've had a moment here that is priceless and I'm not going to let it tarnish it. 19:03 Back to Ange shortly. Next up on the show, our second member of the Millionaires Club, but you have to wait for next week to know who it is. But this fella is loved by so many, I reckon, because so many of us can relate to him. 19:15 Could he kick it, Chris? To put some pressure on him, KB, wrap him up, the best kick in the club. If anyone can kick it, this man can. Stands his ground, starts to bend it back. 19:28 That is the second member of the Millionaires Club next up on the show. 19:36 Let's get back to Ange. 19:38 Well, history, you know, people can look up Tottenham results after you left. I don't think history would reflect too well on that decision. 19:47 See, mate, you went to Nottingham Forest, 9th of September 2025, a two-year deal, eight games, two draws, six losses. You were leading the start of those games and you were sacked in 39 days. 19:58 Ange Postacoglu's reign as a team manager is the shortest in Premier League history at just 39 days. And it all came to an end with his sensational sacking less than 20 minutes after the final siren sounded in the game against Chelsea with Nottingham Forest losing 3-0. 20:18 Nottingham Forest Football Club can confirm that after a series of disappointing results and performances, Ange Postacoglu has been relieved of his duties as head coach with immediate effect. 20:29 This is a positive show, as you know, because I know you listen along the way. So, like, we could get into the nuts and bolts and, you know, as Buck said the other day when he missed out on the Tassie job, go home and kick the dog. But I'd be more interested in, rather than... What went wrong is what did you learn taking a job and being sacked in 39 days? 20:52 Yeah, mate, it was, I think, yeah, look, dude, dude. 20:57 is 39 days enough for anything to sort of be measured? Well, no, it's obviously not. But at the same time, I kind of go, you know what, I think it was probably an indication that it wasn't a great decision for myself to go there and probably not a great decision for the club to appoint me. I think you've got to take equal share of the responsibility there. It was never going to work. I kind of, after sort of the top thing happened, I had the summer with a family and you know, people said, oh, you know, just switch off, relax, but I just, it was the first summer I'd had where I wasn't planning for something and I wasn't great, you know, even sort of the family noticed that I wasn't great because I wasn't, you know, I was sort of agitated that I wasn't planning for something, I wasn't getting ready for something and I just, you know, I kind of didn't know how to deal with things because I'd been doing it for so long straight. 21:59 Did you miss the structure of what was coming or the planning of what was coming or the adrenaline of what was coming? What did you miss? 22:04 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, just all those things. It's just that my mind is used to being occupied, you know, and all of a sudden there's nothing to think about. And I kind of struggled with that as a person because just who I was, you know, for so long. It doesn't mean that, you know, you neglect your family or it was just the norm of who I was as a person even within the family structure that, you know, I was taking phone calls. And it's funny how quiet your phone goes all of a sudden, you know. It's kind of... 22:33 I really found it hard to sort of structure my time and understand what I'm supposed to do because I knew once the league's all, you know, once you're on holiday, it's okay because everyone's on holiday, but then once the league started, well, what was I going to do, just sit around all day in the house? So I really struggled with that. So when the forest thing came up, Everyone around me that knows me and kind of loves and cares for me from, you know, my wife and, like I said, Frank Trimble, they all said don't do it. They all said, look, it's not the right time for you. 23:06 Have some time off. It's probably not the right club for you. And I ignored all of them. I just kind of said, no, I don't. 23:17 I know the challenge. I love the challenge. You know, I thought it was a club that I could make an impact. I knew the volatility of the club but I said that's okay, you know, I'm prepared to take that on. But you kind of know when you don't fit and I sort of felt that from the first day. So I just got to say responsibility. Like I said, it was just where I was probably as a person that I didn't and what I learnt was that, you know, these kind of decisions you have to make, you know, kind of, in isolation of how you're feeling in that moment. 23:47 And the need for me to keep coaching overrode everything else that was quite obvious that, you know what, this is not the opportunity for you, you know, and in the end, you know, you kind of pay the price. And it was, you know, it's brutal, mate. I mean, that was probably the worst thing sort of three hours of my life when I got sacked because, not my life, but my professional life because, you know, I kind of, you learn, I paid a real penance for that decision because I literally walked in after the game I sat, went to the coach's room, sporting directors came in and I wasn't even thinking about, you know, that they're going to sack me and I was kind of still thinking about the game. 24:34 We had another game in a couple of days' time of, you know, geez, we just, because we weren't playing too badly but we just couldn't score goals so we'd need a goal just to break this thing. 24:42 And they kind of, the first words that came out of his mouth were, Lance, you know, you know, the president asked us and the president said, oh, shit, they're sucking me, you know, so. 24:51 Wow. Wow. 24:53 You get sacked in that room and then I kind of go, all right, I'm out of here, you know, because obviously I wasn't in a great frame of mind. I was, you know, who knows what I was going to do if the wrong person said the wrong thing to me. So I walk out the door and literally all the media are there because it's quite a small ground, Forrest's Ground. Yeah. 25:13 All the Genos are there. Now, they've already been informed and kind of they're all looking at me, what I'm going to do, and I'm going, I'm just going to get out of here. But then I hadn't spoken to my assistant coaches and I knew pretty much the ones I brought in, they'd be out as well. So I had to tell them. So I've kind of walked through all the media and they're looking at me and said to the guys, look, they've just sacked me. They'd probably do the same. I said, look, I need to get out of here though. Yeah. 25:39 I'll give you a buzz later. And they said, yeah, look, I just go, don't worry, leave the rest. So I'm walking out. 25:45 with my bag and then the security guy is a great guy and he kind of looked after me when I was there and he said, Ange, I know you want to get out of here, mate, but, you know, Premier League grounds, the roads are blocked for an hour and a half after the game. So he goes, look, go sit in your car. I'll put a couple of security guards around because it was in the car park and we'll wait for the thing. So I'm sitting in my car for about an hour. 26:11 I phoned my wife, Georgia, and said, look, they just sacked me. She goes, look, just come home. I said, yeah, I'm just going to drive home because it was in Nottingham and we were living in London. So I'm sitting in my car for an hour just by myself just thinking, yeah, what the hell's happened to her? And then the security guard sort of taps on the window and says, look, Ange, the roads are open. 26:31 They've sort of walked alongside the car because there's still fans everywhere and we get to the first sort of set of lights and And there's a couple of police officers there and, again, you know, not tapping the window, really nice guys. They said, look, Ange, we want to help you, mate, but once you get to those traffic lights, mate, it's going to take you at least half an hour. You're going to be standstill. 26:51 I go, okay. So I'm sitting in the car, mate. I've got Chelsea supporters giving it to me. I've got Forest supporters who are pretty happy to see me go. 27:02 I'm just sitting in the car, just copping it left, right and centre. You can't react. I've got little kids tapping on the window wanting selfies. 27:09 And again, you know, you're trying to do the right thing. Mate, I'm just going to myself, well, good lesson for you, Angie, paying a penance for not listening to other people and making this decision. 27:21 So it was a tough moment, but... 27:24 I left there with no scars in terms of, you know, I was much more disappointed with the way Tottenham ended than Forrest. Forrest was like, you know, hold your hand up. I made a bad decision. I'll cop it. But, yeah, it wasn't a great day for me. 27:40 You've always been really honest when you've come on the show and obviously I haven't heard any of that, so I appreciate your honesty. I'll ask your honest question back as a result of your honest descriptions. You work so hard. 27:51 You know, couldn't get the job at Brisbane Raw, Socceroos, Japan, Scotland, Tottenham, a second crack at the EPL. 28:01 Were you worried at the time or even now that it was going to stain your reputation and people would forget all the stuff I highlighted that I loved and that would reflect on you moving forward in your professional career? 28:18 Oh, there's no doubt it would have an impact and it has had an impact. But at the same time, I go, mate, you know what, I've had a bad month in 26 years of unbelievable joy, mate. So it was never going to affect me. And there's no doubt because, you know, when I left, even when I finished at Tottenham, there was other clubs that were interested in... 28:41 And to be honest, even after I left Forrest, I got some really good offers, not in the EPL, but with European clubs, you know, really top European clubs. But I kind of made a decision after Forrest that, you know what, I need to take a breather. 28:57 The family need to take a breather because you've got to remember, like, it's not just me on this journey, you know. I mean, I've got three boys. My oldest lives in Greece, but my two younger ones, we left Australia... 29:08 when they were one and three years old, right, and you'll be horrified by this, but they sound more English than they do Australian, mate, which is painful for me, you know. That's not a good look, Ange. 29:20 And the funny thing is, right, because... They were obviously born in Australia. You know, most of them, they went to school and they go, oh, you must be great cricketers. And they've never played cricket in their life, mate, you know. Come on, Ed. Who's your Aussie rules team? You know, like, so, but they'd been, you know, they'd changed, my boys had changed five or six schools in that time, you know, and my wife had to pack up and relocate to five or six different houses and, I kind of said to myself, all right, mate, I've got to give everyone a breather here, you know, not just myself, my family, you know, we've got to just stabilise. 29:58 So I still had some decent offers, but there's no doubt that it tarnished my reputation sort of, you know, in England and certain, you know, probably league jobs that probably I would have been a chance for, you know, that door looked like it closed because of my experience. And there was the people who will just look at that sort of forest experience and, and just saying, look, you know what, he's failed at that level. Now, again, it... 30:30 whether it hurts you reputationally or not, it isn't going to stop me. It isn't going to change what I do or who I am as a person. And from my perspective, it's not unfamiliar territory for me, you know. If anything, it's familiar territory that, you know, it's kind of what's sustained me and probably given me an advantage in many respects is that, you know, people do underestimate me and kind of underestimated me. what I bring and sort of what I've done and, you know, that's probably the space I'm in. 31:00 But at the same time, there's still enough people in the sort of football world that see beyond that kind of obvious stuff and, you know, I kind of segmented my career in kind of the first, you know, the first 10 years was kind of you know, I had such an unbelievable time at my club South Melbourne and, you know, we had some great success there. Then I was kind of youth team coach and then the next period was kind of Brisbane and the Socceroos were again, you know, had some unbelievable experiences and the next period's kind of been this period. 31:38 And as I said to you right at the start, I reckon if I had to make a call, I reckon the next 10 are going to be the best because I just... 31:47 I feel more sort of settled in myself about who I am and what I can do that wherever it takes me and I've got no sort of predetermined plan that I've got to feel the next 10 are probably the ones I'm going to enjoy the most. 32:00 So before you signed at the club you're at with now in Portugal and we'll get to Saudi Arabia, the next step of the journey, Did you get better at switching off is the obvious question. I did, mate. I had to. 32:10 Yeah, yeah, I had to. Yeah, I kind of was forced to but, you know, to be fair, it wasn't easy but I kind of occupied myself with other things. I did some, you know, I did some work with UEFA and it was great because they reached out to me so you kind of go, okay, well, Actually, I'm not this guy from Melbourne anymore that, you know, that people actually, like I said, they're still fascinated with my story. So I ended up doing a lot of work for UEFA with, you know, covering Champions League games for them and doing technical reports, presenting on their pro licence to young coaches and meeting a lot of other guys, you know, in football, outside of football and sort of having real great conversations. 32:50 Yeah. 32:52 I kind of structured it in a different way where my mind was still occupied but not necessarily with, you know, the usual stuff. And, yeah, you know, I took the boys to football training and, you know, did some pick-ups from school, which wasn't a great experience and a great motivating factor for me to get back to working. 33:14 But, yeah, I got better and even though I still had that 33:19 Mate, I'll, you know, any time Frank would say, well, look, club, you know, is interested, I'd go, let's go for it. I kind of, like I said, I added to the family to just have a breather for them, you know, because, you know, everything you see in the public space, they get impacted from, you know, the good and the bad. So... 33:40 And, you know, just because I can sort of, I'm equipped to maybe cope with it, it doesn't necessarily mean they are. So, you know, I kind of understood that, you know, they're kind of the priority right now and so I got better at it. Still keen to coach but, yeah, just a lot better at sort of the day-to-day stuff. 33:59 Well, this is quite huge breaking news because Aj Postacoglu has been announced as the new head coach of Al Nasser. So that means he'll be Cristiano Ronaldo's new boss, doesn't it? He's been out of work since 2025. Of course, he was sacked by Nottingham Forest back in October. But now it appears that he is returning to management. He's been spending the summer working as a bit of a pundit for the World Cup. But he's going to take the next step of his career in the Middle East. So he will be... Coach of Al Nasser and in charge of Cristiano Ronaldo. 34:30 So between Forrest and the job you've just taken in more recent times, just roughly how many conversations could you have had about coaching other, like how many other clubs roughly would have got in touch with Frank and said, well, what's Ange up to roughly? 34:45 Yeah, no, it would go into probably the double figures at various levels. Right. 34:53 The ones that I was really interested probably, yeah, there's probably half a dozen there that I thought, you know what, it's worth a conversation. But again, this time the conversations were different and if I didn't feel right or if the people around me didn't feel right, I kind of said, nah, you know, let's just wait. You know, I thought a real key part of the next one was going to be, well, go where you're really wanted, where people are really keen to get you on board because I kind of, I'm kind of that sort of person. 35:24 I'm all in. You're not going to change me. You're not going to change who I am as a person. So you've kind of got to want what I bring rather than me trying to convince them. And, you know, that was a big part of it. And there were a couple of clubs who kind of sort of had that. But it's just a lot of it was just timing as well of... 35:46 I really wanted to wait till I really wanted to do a pre-season. Again, the forest experience of going in at a club when the season's already started, it was very different. So I thought, you know what, ideally you can't plan these things, but if I can go in in pre-season, that would be great. So, you know, we kind of pushed a lot of things aside till the end of the year. And, yeah, so you kind of have these conversations. 36:11 So... Now, I presume, we'll get to your family. I don't know if they're heading off to Saudi Arabia. So is it – I'll get the pronunciation wrong here. It's Al Nasser? 36:21 Yeah, Al Nasser, yeah. So why? Well, just in the end, like I said, I kind of met with the guys who were – They were in charge and, you know, they were really keen to get me on board. They kind of knew who I was and obviously not knew who I was but knew what I'd bring to the table and felt like that was a good fit for what they have here. Yeah, for me, I've never worried about sort of, yeah, people say, well, okay, it's not in Europe. It's kind of not a higher profile league. 36:51 But I'm... 36:53 you know, I've always kind of railed against people who are snobbish about certain leagues and everything. So I wasn't going to turn around and say, well, no, that's somehow a backward step for me. I never see things that way. I just think, well, okay, is there an opportunity there? Can I make an impact? 37:07 Would I be excited about the prospect of doing it? And it ticked those boxes for me because, you know, it is a league that's obviously invested a lot of money. There's some top managers here. There's some top players here. And, The chance to be a part of that was significant. 37:27 You know, again, when I reflect on my career, what stands out for me is that I've been unbelievably blessed in being part of other people's journeys. So when I was a player, you know, Ferenc Pushkas was my coach, I think I discussed that. He was one of the greatest players of all time, right? 37:48 And just that association... 37:51 has been unbelievable for me in that I'm a small part of that man's story, you know, a real small part, but I'm still a small part. I mean, the Champions League final this year was in Budapest and I went there for UEFA and the amount of people, Hungarian people, who just wanted to come and say hello to me because they knew I had this. So I thought to myself along the way, you know, I've been pretty blessed, you know, whether that was, you know, with the Socceroos, you know, I work with arguably our greatest head player in Timmy Cahill, so I'm a small part of his story. You know, you mentioned Sonny, you know, the greatest Korean player, I'm a small part of his story. 38:24 So there's no doubt, you know. 38:27 Cristiano Ronaldo's here, you know, you kind of go, okay. Yeah, I know. Yeah, exactly. So you kind of go, you know what, I can become a small part of his story as well and not from a selfish point of view but just from my own kind of life's journey of everything I wanted to do since I've been a kid and you get associated with these people along the way and that was part of the attraction of saying, well, okay, I'll get the chance to share his wrestling with one of them. No doubt when he's finished he'll be you know, his story would be told forever in a day. 39:00 And not that they'll tell my story alongside, but I can tell that story, you know. And that was a part of it as well that, you know, I kind of... So all those kind of factors and, you know, I thought it does also give my family a bit of a breather in that you're not in the sort of coalface of the attention of, you know, sort of European football, what that entails. The family will stay in London. The boys are in a great school. Right. 39:29 You know, my wife's really settled there and, you know, it's just really important for me, for them to be really settled. We're going to be living apart, which is the first time we've done that, so that's going to be a bit of a challenge. But, you know, it's not a long flight and there's enough breaks where we'll get connected. But it just was the right decision for us for where we're at at the moment. And, yeah, since I started, I just love being Cajun again for sure and excited about it. 39:58 First thing with me, very simple. Just respect. Respect above everything else. 40:03 Every day we come in here, we appreciate. 40:08 So I presume off the back of the World Cup, your man Ronaldo is not there at pre-season at this particular point in time. So you haven't met him yet? 40:32 Yeah, I have, yeah. 40:32 I had a chat to him and... Oh, well, now, Ange, what we would say in the media is you buried the lead there, right? So is it on the phone? Like, is it a Zoom? You having a coffee? 40:41 No, no, no. No, he was kind enough to come in and say hello because obviously we're in Portugal and he's got some small digs just down the road from here, mate. 40:51 Just past Struggle Street down there. 40:53 Yeah, and so he came in and just to say hello, basically, and it was great, mate. He's... 41:02 He's a good-looking rooster, mate, let me tell you. 41:03 I was about to say, do you have your shirt on or off? Because every time I see him, I'm seeing the ads. 41:07 Yeah, yeah. 41:09 And it was great. It was great. You know, we had a great chat. And the thing about it is, and like I said, I'll be lucky enough to be around some, you know, some great players and they all share the same sort of characteristics irrespective of kind of the personality is that They're all hugely motivated, mate. They're all very, very focused. You know, people say, you know, how do you deal with... And it was actually, I think it was a former coach of the club that said it. It goes, you know, that sometimes people don't realise it's a lot easier dealing with the great players rather than the ones who think they're great, you know, because the great ones... 41:48 They put in the hard work. They're motivated. They do the right things. And as a coach, as a manager, you go, you know what, I want a piece of that. And you get that sense. He's still very, very motivated. He's still got some really clear goals. He's close to scoring 1,000 goals, which is going to be unbelievable. And, you know, from that perspective, yeah, it was great to chat with him. But, you know, I said to him, mate, go and have a holiday. Go with your family and chill. I mean, his life... 42:17 To be honest, we've got no idea what his life's like, mate. Who would, you know? Like, it's just incredible. 42:22 I can't believe you're going to be his manager. I actually can't believe you're going to be his manager. Yeah. I know there's a whole club, but, like, yeah, it's quite extraordinary. 42:32 It is. And, like I said, it's pretty cool. And, you know, there were some fantastic players at the club. You know, Joao Felix, who was also part of the Portuguese national teams at the World Cup. Sadio Mane, who was at Liverpool, Kingsley Coman, and, you know, Inigo Martinez, who was at Barcelona. So there's some fantastic players here. And even the Saudi players, some national team players who I know. And the level in general has been really good since I've been here. 43:00 Yeah, you know, the fact that, like I said, I'm going to share a dressing room with one of the greats is, you know, I make no sort of secrets about it. It was one of the enticements of the job that, you know, gives me another experience that, you know, I can sort of reflect on the right time. 43:20 I love the conversation. You mentioned that early days you signed up with Frank and you said, well, I don't know how you're going to make a dollar out of me. But then you mentioned Saudi Arabia. Now, this is where you can choose to comment or not comment. 43:32 Rumoured to be on a two-year contract with the Saudi Arabian team, Al Nassar, rumoured to be 10 million pounds, a year, which to my calculations is $20 million Australian a year. Are we in the ballpark there or is that something you can't comment on? 43:49 Yeah, no, no, there's no doubt that, you know, obviously the financial inducements. But it's – I've been pretty lucky. Like I said, I've been pretty blessed that I've done well in life in terms of in the last sort of 10 years where, you know, we can live the life we kind of want to. It wasn't – you know, like when you kind of reach this level wherever you go, you – You know, if you're sensible, you earn good money. You kind of realise, and especially the way, you know, me and my family live our life, it's not governed by sort of, I'm not going to be, you know, a person who's going to be driven by those kind of things. 44:27 But, you know, you get well compensated, but I think you've earned that right with what you've done in your career and, you know. 44:35 So, yeah, it gives us a chance to do some more things in our lives. 44:39 Yeah. 44:40 You referenced Liverpool and the discussion we had all those, you know, episodes ago. 44:46 Is the dream still alive? 44:48 Not for Liverpool as such because I just think you kind of leave that with your childhood. 44:58 When we played Liverpool at Anfield that first year at Tottenham, I kind of promised myself that We obviously get to the ground pretty early, but before the players go out, I'm going to go walk out on the pitch and I'm going to go walk out of the tunnel beneath the sort of this is Anfield sign. It's not the old sign, but... And I was going to have that moment for myself, just to me, walk through, you know, and... 45:22 And I'm walking and as I'm walking, I'm about to walk through and I hear somebody say, hey, Ange, and I turn around and it's Kenny Dalgleish, right? Now, Kenny Dalgleish was my hero, right? He was on my walls. I had 100 posters of Kenny Dalgleish on my walls when I was a kid, right? 45:40 And because I obviously made Celtic, I'd met him months before and he said, hey, how are you going? And he's obviously an ambassador for Liverpool. 45:47 And he just says, how are you going? And we're talking. 45:51 And by the time I finished talking, I'm out on the field and he's gone sort of one way and I've gone the other. 45:58 And I just stopped myself and I said, I just walked through the Anfield Tunnel with Kenny Dalgleish. 46:04 I go, mate, if you asked me to pay a million pounds to have that experience, I would have. And it just happened, you know. And now whether it was fate, God, my old man from up above saying I'm going to create this. 46:15 So I've kind of lived all those experiences now. I've kind of those childhood things. So... 46:22 The goals now are just, like I said, I've got a feeling the next 10 years or so are going to be kind of the ones I enjoy the most because I'm going to do stuff that I really think I can make even more of an impact than I have before. I've got a freedom now to do that. And where that takes me, I've got no idea and I'm not putting a limit on it, that's for sure. But I still think there's some pretty cool stuff coming up. 46:45 We always finish the same way. You will have answered this before, but times have changed. 46:50 Advice you could pass on to the youngsters that listen to this show that want to achieve success in their field. You've achieved tremendous success, enormous success now, and I hope people like it made me smile watching the clips of the Tottenham fans and Celtic walking around and people just cheering you and singing your songs. Like the joy you've brought to people is I think it's an extraordinary thing to have brought so much joy to so many people, but what advice would you give to people that want to achieve something in their chosen field, Ange? 47:24 Well, I guess I think I've said it before that, you know, whatever you're passionate about and, you know, they say, you know, sort of the key to life is to end up doing what you're passionate about in terms of a vocation or in terms of leading your life is sometimes people think that that's somehow easier but it's actually you've got to understand that when you find your passion in life and that's what you want to do, you have to work hard. 47:55 There's no other way. You have to work hard. You're not following that passion because it's somehow easier. It's that you love what you do so much that you go, I don't want to lose this now, you know. Like I said, I... 48:09 I left the National Australia Bank in 1996 working as a teller. 48:16 And since that day, I haven't worked a day in my life, mate, you know. I've got up every morning and I just thought, even in the worst days, even, you know, whether it was forest or whatever, I still get up going, oh, my God, you know, I'm blessed to do what I do, but I work hard at it. You know, like I said to you at the start, I know that you would have been really passionate about this project of a podcast, backwind podcast, but I guarantee you work your backside off on it, you know, and... 48:45 I think it's not a dirty word. It's not a bad thing to say, I work hard. It shows that you're committed to something, that you really care about something, that you want this thing more than anything else. And whether that's a relationship or that's an occupation or whether that's a calling in your life, Work hard, you know. Don't want it to be easy because the worst thing you can do is find your passion and then it kind of dissipates into nothing because you just didn't want to, you felt like you didn't want to put in the hard work, you know. 49:21 Ange, I can't thank you enough for appearing on the show again. I know how busy you are and how much time you've given up. The third time you've been on the show, unfortunately, as I said at the start, there is no check in the Millionaires Club, but there's a lot of gratitude. Good luck in Saudi Arabia, mate. And in four years' time, I look forward to you coming on again and exploring. And again, mate, just congratulations for bringing so much joy to so many people in so many different parts of the world. It's an extraordinary journey and I hope it continues to pump along for you and your family, mate. 49:50 I'll bring it, mate. Appreciate it. And, yeah, look forward to our chat in four years' time, mate. Who knows where we'll be. 49:55 I'll pencil it in. Well done. 49:56 Good, mate. 50:00 What a good man Ange Postacoglu is. I love his outlook and his ability to have a laugh at what were no doubt tough times. May success, trophies and happiness continue to follow him on his wild and wonderful journey. Until next week with the second member of our Millionaires Club, you know the drill by now. Peace and love. 50:19 And we can do it if we try, try, try If we try, try, try If we try, try, try