The Tucker Carlson Show

00:00 If you remember the 1980s, you probably remember the anti-apartheid movement, or as was called the United States, the anti-apartheid movement. 00:09 Apartheid was the longstanding system in South Africa in which the minority white population ran the political system. And to some extent, it was a system of separation where in certain parts of the country, black populations lived in what were called townships and white populations lived in their own towns. And there was a legal separation between the groups. It was a kind of segregation. 00:33 And as noted, it was longstanding. It went on for many decades. And in the United States, beginning in the 70s and then accelerating into the 1980s, it was extremely unpopular with activists, particularly on college campuses. So if you think about protests against this or that regime that have broken out over the last 20 years on campuses, pick one. East Timor, Darfur, whatever campus advocates, activists, radicals are mad about. In the 1980s, they were mad about apartheid. 01:05 And when you went to college campuses, Brown University famously, there were shanty towns on the quad at a lot of schools where kids built mock shanties, hovels, shacks that were supposed to represent the squalor in which the black population of South Africa was living. 01:25 Apartheid was hard to defend. It was racial discrimination. There's no question about that. And so over time, the anti-apartheid movement, not just in the United States, but throughout the West, had an effect. And we should note that in the U.S., political figures did not oppose the college anti-apartheid movement. They endorsed it. They encouraged it. 01:48 Very much unlike the anti-Israel protests of a couple of years ago on college campuses. Nobody went to jail for opposing apartheid on an Ivy League campus. Nobody had his green card pulled or was deported. No, America's ruling class was four square behind the campus protesters. And again, they were protesting something that was very obviously unfair. Racial segregation is unfair always because you don't choose your race. 02:17 In any case, in part due to unrelenting pressure from the United States and Britain and the West generally, apartheid fell in 1994. And it did so peacefully. The white government basically handed over its power in an election. And of course, on the other side was a then very famous figure called Nelson Mandela, who had been a revolutionary, He was spending decades in jail for trying to bomb a train. But by the time 1994 rolled around, he was a figure of reconciliation and peace and power sharing between black and white. 02:53 And so those elections took place in 1994 and the rest of the world sighed a sigh of relief and pointed to South Africa and said, it's going to work. It's going to be great. 03:05 And then by and large, the West stopped paying attention to what happened in South Africa and that intentional aversion of gaze has gone on for, well, 32 years now. But what did happen in South Africa? Well, a lot of things and none of them good. The country fell apart economically and it did not, by the way, become less racist. Over the past 30 years, the government of South Africa, run by the same political party that took power in 1994, the African National Congress, the ANC, has passed almost as many race-specific laws as as the apartheid government did, and in some ways is much more brutal. 03:43 A huge percentage of the white population has left to New Zealand, Australia, the UK, United States, and Canada, to English-speaking countries around the world. And if you talk to any of them, they left because they felt there was no more opportunity in South Africa because they had the wrong skin color. 04:02 Meanwhile, the economy collapsed. Infrastructure collapsed. 04:07 So what you had in South Africa 32 years later after apartheid was every bit as much racism, but a lot less electricity. Probably not a win. 04:18 What's interesting, however, is that almost none of the people in the United States and Europe who called for an end to apartheid were willing to admit what had happened, partly because they were implicated in it. South Africa didn't get any better. In fact, it got much worse. And the racism, the one thing that they correctly opposed about apartheid, had increased too. 04:38 It had just switched sides. 04:41 So fast forward from 1994 to May of last year and the White House. 04:47 This was a part of the Trump term where the president was still trying to make good on his campaign promises before giving up entirely in favor of prosecuting an Iran war. But at the time, last May of 2025, President Trump was doing something he suggested he would do on the campaign trail, and that's say something publicly about anti-white racism, which is widespread, in some cases codified, including in the United States. And In a lot of ways, the only institutional racism that's still allowed in the Western world. 05:20 And Trump had suggested as he was running for president that he would be the one person brave enough to say something about that on the grounds that all racism is wrong. Not because it's bad to hurt one group, but because it's bad to hurt any group. It's a universal principle. It applies to everybody. 05:37 And so in May of last year, Donald Trump gave this press conference. Watch. 05:43 We have many people that feel they're being persecuted and they're coming to the United States. So we take from many, many locations if we feel there's persecution or genocide going on. 05:55 And we had a lot of people. I must tell you, Mr. President, we have had a tremendous number of people, especially since they've seen this. 06:04 Generally, they're white farmers and they're fleeing South Africa. Excuse me. Turn the lights down. 06:11 Turn the lights down and just put this on. It's right behind you. 06:16 There's nothing this government can do. With or without you, people are going to occupy land. We require no permission from you, from the president, from no one. 06:29 These are articles over the last few days. 06:32 Death of people. 06:36 Death. 06:37 Death. 06:39 Death. 06:40 Horrible death. 06:43 Death. 06:44 I don't know. 06:47 White South Africans are fleeing because of the violence and racist laws. 06:53 And this is all. I mean, I'll give these to you. So when you say, what would I like to do? I don't know what to do. Look at this. White South African couples say that they were attacked violently. But the fake news in this country doesn't talk about that. They don't want to talk about it, but now they have to talk about it. But they won't. This won't even be a subject. 07:16 So the man next to him was Cyril Ramaphoso, the president of South Africa. And the clip that Trump played, he played a couple of clips there. 07:25 included a well-known political figure, an ANC-aligned figure called Julius Malema, calling for the murder of whites openly. Now, calling for the murder of anyone on the basis of race is a crime in South Africa, which has hate crimes laws, but he has never been punished for that and continues to do it even until this day. Again, acting on behalf of the government run by the man you just saw sitting next to Donald Trump. 07:51 And so Donald Trump, in his inarticulate way, if you didn't know the backstory, you might not know exactly what he was talking about. 07:57 but was trying to call the world's attention to the reality of South Africa. And the reality is that has been for a long time a racist reality. The government treats people differently on the basis of their skin color. And if you have the wrong skin color in South Africa, you can get hurt, raped, or killed. And that's just a fact incontestable. And yet it is contested in the United States. 08:22 What's so striking is not that Trump said that, though no president has ever come close to saying anything like that, and good for Trump. 08:30 But the response to Trump saying that really told you everything about how we got a system like that in South Africa in the first place and why we still have a version of it here in the United States, a system in which whites are at a structural disadvantage in hiring, college admissions, government contracting. That still exists in the U.S. as it has for many decades, and everybody knows it. But no one's allowed to talk about it or people feel intimidated out of noticing it because as one, the American news media screams racism every time someone points out the existence of anti-white racism. 09:09 Here, for example, is how CBS News covered the press conference you just saw. Watch. 09:14 President Trump has stopped all U.S. refugee admissions except one group, the white Afrikaner ethnic minority that once led South Africa's brutal apartheid regime. The first group has already arrived in America, claiming they've been victims of violence and discrimination. Claims of a white genocide are often circulated by right-wing groups, but are simply not true, said Africana academic Pete Crowkamp. 09:44 There's no sign of it, never has been. This is the land of milk and honey if you're white. 09:48 Everyone's joking that they're surprised to wake up and suddenly find it's too dangerous to go outside because there's a white genocide. So there is humour and there's also frustration. As for Afrikaner farmers, most will say Uncle Donny, as they call President Trump, is being fed a false narrative. 10:08 Oh. 10:09 So there are two things to learn from CBS News' report. One is that none of this is happening, and if you think it is, you're a racist. And two, that the apartheid regime was brutal. In other words, when the whites had power, they were brutal. And the implication there, of course, and some will say it out loud, is that any brutality visited on the whites in the past 32 years is deserved because it's payback for what other white people did 32 years ago. 10:38 All right, now. Now, of course, CBS News has no way of knowing this. That wasn't a CBS News employee you saw there. CBS News doesn't have a bureau in South Africa. That was a stringer, a freelance employee that CBS hired. As for the Afrikaner academic, is he a mainstream voice in South Africa? No, he's not. 10:57 And then the claim, if you ask a white farmer in South Africa, how many white farmers did CBS News poll on this question? Well, as far as we can tell, none. 11:06 There is no news in the news segment you just saw. It is a propaganda piece designed to intimidate you from asking follow-up questions like, Is there racial discrimination against whites in South Africa? Have white farmers been killed for being white? If so, how many? Those questions go completely unaddressed because were they to address them, they would find that everything the president implied was entirely true. 11:31 But it wasn't just CBS News, which, by the way, is now run by Barry Weiss, who is a professional racial grievance monger whose entire public career is devoted to protecting the interests of one group, a group she describes as, quote, my people. But any attempt by other groups to do that is shouted down immediately. 11:54 You'll notice. And in case it wasn't just CBS News, here's ABC News' reaction to the same press conference. 12:02 Tonight, an extraordinary scene in the Oval Office. President Trump ambushing the president of South Africa with false claims the nation is engaged in genocide against white farmers. President Cyril Ramaphosa said he came to the White House to discuss trade. 12:17 We are essentially here to reset the relationship between the United States and South Africa. 12:23 But Trump had other ideas. The president insists white South African farmers are being persecuted and murdered on a mass scale. Unproven claims that have been amplified by Elon Musk, a native of South Africa. There is a crime problem in South Africa, but there is no evidence it is racially motivated or amounts to genocide. White people make up only 7% of the country, but own the vast majority of its farmland. 12:48 So again, That's not a news piece. There's no information, despite the little graphic at the bottom, which is designed to let you know whites have too much already. This is just justice. But it begins by describing the president's comments as an ambush of the poor president of South Africa, who's just here trying to strike up a new relationship with the United States. And here Trump ambushes him. 13:13 Actually, that same president, Cyril Ramaphosa, has said openly anti-white things in public for many years. He not that long ago pointed to neighboring Zimbabwe, which did, in fact, genocide its whites. There are almost none left in the country, stole their land, allowed them to be murdered by mobs, and said that is a model for South Africa. That president that they're defending is the victim of an ambush. 13:37 has said point blank many times in public that his plan is to steal the not just the real estate, the land of the white population, but their personal property without compensation. That's his party's official position. 13:50 In fact, as the ANC, his party phrases it, compensation will be, quote, nil, which means nothing. 13:58 So there are real questions here that might be worth exploring if you were a news organization. But instead, ABC News, like CBS News, dismisses everything Trump says as false without proving it's false, just stating it's false. It's false. In any case, the whites are bad. 14:14 This is and has been for decades the position of every news organization in the United States. 14:20 And not simply that of groups who you thought were dedicated to protecting the human rights of human beings. 14:27 Here's the ADL's statement on claims of white genocide in South Africa, and we're quoting. 14:33 For decades, white supremacists globally were cheerleaders for the institutionalized white supremacy of apartheid in South Africa. They have reacted bitterly to the end of the racist policy and to the progress South Africans have made in pursuit of racial equality and reconciliation. Keep in mind, the ADL is a group whose aims are to protect global Jewry. That's what ADL says it exists to do. Why are they attacking whites in South Africa who say they are the victims of institutional racism, which they are, and of organized violence, which they are? 15:06 Why would it be in the interest of ADL to attack them for that? What exactly did they do wrong? 15:11 How are they anti-Semites for not wanting to be killed on their farms? They don't explain that. But the statement goes on. 15:17 White supremacists have seized upon some of the farm-related violence in South Africa since the end of apartheid to peddle a propaganda campaign that exaggerates and distorts the situation to imply that the South African whites are imperiled. 15:31 Again, what possible interest would the Anti-Defamation League have in attacking whites in South Africa who say they're being killed, especially since there are many, many hundreds who have been killed? And that's documented. That's not a guess, and it's not a conspiracy theory. And every single one of them was killed by a black South African. This is... 15:52 intra-racial crime. And it is racially motivated. And the testimony of almost every survivor corroborates that. 16:00 So why is it in the interest of the ADL not simply to deny it's happening, but to attack the survivors of it and their family members? You have to ponder that for a minute. 16:11 Here's Wikipedia's response to this racial conspiracy theory. Quote, white genocide is a political myth based on pseudoscience, pseudohistory, and ethnic hatred, and is driven by a psychological panic, often termed white extinction anxiety. 16:32 White extinction, often referred to as white extinction anxiety. 16:35 So let's just, I don't know, get the demographic numbers, which are publicly available for the biggest white countries in Europe and North America and ask a really simple question, is the percentage, the proportion of the white population going up or down, say, over the past 50 years? Has it gone up or down? Well, it's not only gone down, it's bottomed out. The United States went from nearly 90% white over 60 years to probably less than half white. 17:05 So that's white extinction anxiety. 17:09 No, those are facts. So again, it's not enough to pretend that it's not happening. Wikipedia, like the ADL, like CBS News, like ABC News, feels the moral obligation to attack anyone who happens to notice what's happening. 17:29 The facts are themselves racist. Objectively, again Wikipedia, white people are not dying out or facing extermination. The purpose of the conspiracy theory is to justify a commitment to a white nationalist agenda in support of calls to violence. 17:49 Noticing is hate. Noticing is violence. 17:54 So underneath all of this are two questions. 17:58 One, is it actually happening or not? And wouldn't it be interesting to find out rather than just dismissing it out of hand as an act of violence to notice that people are being raped and murdered? 18:10 Wouldn't it be easier just to talk to people in South Africa and see what their experience is, do a little reporting on the subject? 18:18 And the second question is, is it ever okay to attack, to hurt people on the basis of their race? 18:26 And of course, in the view of the ADL, of the anonymous Wikipedia authors of ABC and CBS and NBC and pretty much every news organization in the United States. Yes, it is okay in certain circumstances. Not all races are equal. Not all death is the same. The death of some groups, the oppression of some groups is totally unacceptable. And the deaths of other groups, the oppression of those groups is morally justified. 18:52 So it's worth saying it out loud. That is wrong. That is the definition of a distorted racist worldview. 19:01 The only acceptable worldview is that all human life is equal in value. It's a universalist perspective. 19:09 Every person is not of identical ability, but every person is of identical value. And it is always wrong. No matter what the color or ethnicity or culture or language, it is always unacceptable to kill the innocent. 19:27 And that would include Palestinians in Gaza. It would include whites in the Transvaal. 19:32 It would include every single Jews, Filipinos. It would include every person. It is always wrong to hurt people who did nothing wrong. 19:44 And that would include hurting people because of how they were born, which is not a crime. It's an accident. 19:51 And so you should know that in denying the existence of something that is objectively true, the people who deny it are revealing what they really think, which is it's okay to kill some people. You should know that. 20:07 We're often assured that Christians are safe in the Holy Land. Is that true? 20:13 Well, the descendants of the very first Christians, these are families who have worshiped in the land of Jesus for centuries, for millennia, are now facing enormous pressure to flee their own homes. War and anti-Christian terrorism are driving them out and untold numbers of innocent people are left feeling lost and without hope. 20:32 This is why we are truly, genuinely proud to support the Vulnerable People Project. VPP is one of the very few organizations in the world consistently helping vulnerable Christians throughout the Holy Land, not hurting them, not lying to them, not trying to ethnically cleanse them, but helping them for real. 20:48 Because of the generosity of our audience, VPP raised enough support to host a Bible summer camp for the children of Tabay. We saw pictures from that camp. It's an amazing sight, and we're really proud to be part of it. This work makes a real difference in the lives of good people, but it's not possible without support from people like you. A gift of just $33 provides a day of protection and support for vulnerable Christians in the West Bank. A monthly gift of $83 helps sustain that protection all month long. We hope you will visit SaveWestBankChristians.com and stand with Christians in the Holy Land, the place where Christianity began, the land that Jesus walked. 21:27 That's SaveWestBankChristians.com. Thanks. 21:32 Meantime, we thought it'd be worth talking to someone who lives in South Africa, an actual South African farmer. So we invited him to our house and spent a great deal of time with him. His name is Leon Lotz. We're about to show you the interview we did with him two days ago. And we warn you before you watch this, that this is one of the most wrenching conversations we've ever had. It's shocking. We believe every word of it is true, but judge for yourself, Leon Lotz. 21:57 Leon, thank you for doing this very much. So in the United States, we are told that farm murders are not real and that people who talk about farm invasions, the murder of white farmers in South Africa are both delusional, they're making it up, and they're racist. 22:17 Is it real? 22:22 I can speak off my own behalf on everybody that I know. 22:27 So I myself come through a farm murder where my father-in-law was shot and killed in front of my wife and my kids. 22:40 My wife was raped at the same time by one neighbour. So I moved from that farm to another farm to get out of the crime scene. I moved to the Karoo where I thought it was much safer. 22:56 We were there for a couple of months and then the one next door neighbor got murdered. 23:03 His wife made it, they shot her twice. 23:08 I bought a farm from a lady called Marlies Daniels and Fred in Middlebrook in the Eastern Cape. Her parents got executed on their knees, shot behind the head. 23:29 Two years back, a guy that rented a farm in the same area, they slit his throat like an animal. 23:46 I have got one here as well. 23:49 I don't know whether the camera can see this. 23:51 I see it. 23:56 What is that from? That is another, this was also an attack that I actually, there's so many attacks that I come through, three proper attacks, and this one was almost forgotten. And I got a stamped wood in my leg, on this side of my leg, on this side. 24:12 That one I survived. 24:16 So you, when you do get attacked, you stay away from the police. 24:22 because if you do report or they do catch one, the first thing that will happen to you is they will open a case of assault against you. 24:33 So they will lock you up first and then hopefully you'll be out in two, three days out of jail, whatever depends on who you know as attorneys or whatever will happen. 24:43 And most of these cases, the murders don't get investigated, the dockets are empty. 24:50 Um... 24:52 We know many of them, we can prove this. This is not something against the government or whatever, but it doesn't get investigated. 25:01 In some of these pieces, fingers point straight to police. 25:09 Brent's docket is empty. 25:12 In Steinsburg, there's just nothing. 25:16 The other thing that they lie about is the death certificates. 25:22 I've got the death certificates. I've got pictures for you. 25:26 My father-in-law's one, I forced them to put on the death certificate murder. Eventually they put on it with massive conflict. 25:33 They put on it a gunshot wound to abdomen. 25:37 The other death certificates of people that I know that got murdered says cause of death are natural causes. 25:45 So they don't investigate the murders. 25:49 Nothing happens. 25:52 So how can the stats prove that we're being murdered? 25:56 There's about 30,000 farmers left, white farmers left in South Africa. 26:01 How many were there in 1994 when the government changed? 26:04 I think more than 100,000. I'm not sure of the figures, but it must be more than 100,000 farmers. 26:10 Or 30,000. 26:11 The big ones has got bigger and bigger. 26:15 The smaller ones, like myself, we are first in line for fire. 26:21 We have got top, top farmers in South Africa, like really good farmers. Under the circumstances we're farming, might take my head off for some of those farmers producing food. And we're producing enough food in all these circumstances that we can export food. 26:39 So telling us that we're lying is... 26:45 Our own ambassador here in America, Mr. Rolf Meyer, says that he's a white South African and he will speak on behalf of us. 26:52 I would like Mr. Meyer to really talk the truth. He actually needs to be arrested for whatever they've done to humans, even in the National Party. 27:05 He needs to be arrested. He closes his eyes now and say that we don't get murdered. Please come with us that we can show you. Come live with me for three days. 27:15 Mr. Rupert said when he was here with Mr. Trump that he sleeps with his doors open. 27:20 Mr. Rupert is a billionaire. 27:24 This is Johan Rupert. 27:25 Yeah, I am not upset with him. I'm breeding racehorses as well, and Johan also breeds horses. I actually need him in the industry. Without him, we don't have a racehorse industry. 27:36 but he cannot sleep with his doors open if he lives the way I live. 27:44 He's got all the security with him. We haven't got that luxury. 27:48 If you drive in South Africa, wherever you go, you will see burglar proofing, barbed wire fencing, steel palisade fences, alarm systems, cameras, dogs, whatever. 28:04 When we came through here last night, it's absolutely miracle. There's wooden houses, there's cars standing outside. We can't leave cars outside. 28:14 They will break in those cars, steal the batteries, steal the tires or the rims off, and they will murder you for a vehicle. It is the insurance that we pay to be safe in our houses. 28:29 There's thousands of rands a month. My insurance is 20,000 rand a month. 28:36 To have insurance, it's a fact that they will come and break in again. I mean, I've been through three farm attacks. The one I actually forgot. It's a way of living. 28:52 The older you get, the more tired you get of all this bullshit. 28:58 And I am so tired of my own people and a British person sitting in England, and a Pete Koukamp, and a Rulf Meyer, and Rudolf Landmann, and whoever they are, in your own country telling that we are not being murdered. 29:17 They can't say that we're not being murdered because it's the biggest fraud in the world that it's not under death certificates. 29:24 These murder cases don't get investigated. 29:27 When they do catch murderers, the one that murdered my father, the police said he murdered 23 people. I didn't say that. I didn't thumb suck that. 29:37 He got a life sentence for 146 years. He came from Mozambique, a black man. 29:44 He was not even, he was an immigrant? 29:46 Yeah, Mario Konzo. 29:49 So a month back, I started to find out where he was. 29:53 And then they came back saying they're very ashamed, but he was released after a year. 29:59 So whenever you in South Africa are in jail, you sit max 10% of your sentence, then you walk. 30:09 After murdering your father-in-law? 30:11 Yeah, a murder for Africa. There was a person working for me. He stabbed his own people. 30:17 He's now sitting in jail for three years. Not one of the people he stabbed died. 30:22 My father died. He raped my wife. 30:27 He sat here and he's out. 30:30 And how is this possible? 30:32 They don't investigate anything. You can't get anywhere. You don't lay a case. 30:38 You will go to jail first. 30:45 Now, we are getting murdered. 30:47 The difference between our murders and the Cape Flat murders, The Cape Flat murders is the same ethnic group. If I call about ethnic groups, I don't know if the world understands this, we've got black people, we've got brown people, we've got white people in South Africa. Then we've got immigrants from Mozambique, Zimbabwe, all of Zimbabwe is in South Africa, as does Mozambique. 31:13 There's people from Malawi in South Africa. 31:16 So every now and then there's xenophobia, they push them out. 31:20 but I don't know how far they go and then they back again. 31:26 I think these illegal immigrants will build their houses and then when there's enough houses, they will be chased out so they can just take their houses for free and then they just carry on. 31:36 But I think the difference between the murders and the Cape Flats is the same ethnic group murder their own people. 31:43 Malema will stand up there and say, kill the boer, kill the farmer. So a boer is a farmer in Afrikaans. 31:52 he actually gives them an order to kill us. They don't steal. It's not a theft gone wrong. 31:58 They come to murder us. They don't steal anything. They will take weapons, urinate on you, put their feces on you, whatever, rape. Put their feces on you? So the one main thing of it is when they do these things, they will get their own feces out, spread it all over their house and on the people they murder. That is the way they do it. 32:21 to dishumane or dehumanize you, whatever they do. 32:26 Owning a home has always been the core of the American dream. It's the asset that families work their lives to build, a place of stability, security, and actual wealth. But too many homeowners right now are stuck swiping credit cards to cover groceries, paying a survival tax of 20% interest or more. 32:42 So we're against debt. We always say that. But you can't buy a house without debt right now. Almost anybody has to take out a loan. 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There's more white people in South Africa than 30,000, but there's only about 30,000 white farmers that farm. 34:04 There's no way that we as white farmers will go and stand there and sing, kill the worker, kill the whatever. 34:14 Kill the black. We don't do that. 34:17 We don't go out murdering them, but if you open social media, you'll see black people reporting that we at White Farmers are murdering hundreds and thousands of blacks. Where? 34:29 Where do we do that? 34:32 There's no place that we sing like Malema that is all over that just did it on Saturday again. 34:39 Kill the farmer, kill the boer. 34:41 Politically, that is correct for the ANC. 34:46 We can't have an old flag, that is hate speech. But this man can order people to kill. 34:54 Like he did with some of the people that's here with me. 34:58 They were singing that, kill the farmer, kill the boy, and then they attack you. 35:04 So, a different ethnic group will come and murder us as whites. 35:10 White people don't murder white farmers. 35:14 There is white people that murder. That needs to be, I don't know where we've got to go with them, but there's criminals in every society. 35:25 But in a civil society, how can you do things like this? How can you heat up an iron that you iron clothes with, and when you rape a woman, burn her with that iron on the inside of her thighs, on her face, while you rape her bite pieces out of her lip, and carry on for days in a shack. 35:52 I know of people that they've taken off the pipes of the washing machine while they tie the wife to a chair. 36:00 The husband had to look, she had to look at the husband, push the pipe down his throat, cook the kettle, and pour the boiled water down his throat. 36:11 And then Rolf Mayer will say, this is not happening. 36:16 our own president, like they're calling souverainity now. 36:23 Now that the American government has imposed sanctions on their visas. 36:30 So what does this souverainity mean to them? 36:35 Jan van Riebeek apparently came in in 1625. 36:40 So all the people of color then got poor. 36:47 I was born in 66, 1966. 36:53 I bought my first farm with money I saved doing farrier work on horses. 37:00 I put it in a tin. I bought a farm after Nelson Mandela was released. 37:04 Now they want to take my property for free, not pay me for it. No compensation. You were a blacksmith shoeing horses? Yes. Yes. 37:13 That's how I made money to eventually buy a farm. I didn't inherit it. I didn't get a loan. I didn't qualify. 37:21 So now they want to just take whatever I've worked for. 37:24 So you didn't take your farm from black people? 37:27 I've never murdered people. I've never taken any farm from anybody. I bought a farm that was in the market for three years in the new South Africa while after Nelson Mandela was released. So why didn't a black person buy the farm? 37:41 So you think they're going to try and take it from you because you're white? 37:44 I think it's a definite that we will lose our farms. I don't think it's going to take too long. 37:50 This is what Nelson Mandela is screaming for. This is what they're doing. 37:54 They're hiding this through the whole world. 37:57 We are producing food. 37:59 We're not there for the political side of it. 38:02 I've got nothing to do with the political side of it. I just want to live and be free. 38:08 I can't have a gun all the time. 38:13 Can you start at the beginning of the story that you told at the outset of your father-in-law's murder? What happened? 38:24 So my father was farming with pigs. 38:26 He had a naval break operation. 38:30 My wife went there to look after the farming operation while he was in hospital. He came out on the Friday. 38:41 I had a horse racing at Turfontein Racecourse in Johannesburg on the Saturday. I actually entered this horse just to get to my father-in-law so that I have an excuse to go there. 38:56 The farm is about 600 kilometers away from Turfontein Racecourse. I left there four o'clock in the morning on Saturday. 39:06 The horse ran, I think it ran last. 39:09 I went back to my father's farm, offloaded the horse. 39:12 And eight o'clock that evening, my wife said to me, my wife is a very thin, posture-wise woman. She was about 50 kilos, 54 kilograms. 39:30 So eight o'clock that evening, my wife said to me, don't you want to go back to the farm? 39:36 um just now they steal the sheep or break into the wise into the house while if we're not there so under northern circumstances my father would first jumped up and said you're not driving back you came here this morning you didn't sleep you're staying over till the next morning so the lord must have saved me and i got up from the table took the horse box load the horse and went back i arrived there around about three o'clock Just after I arrived, the phone rang and it was my mother-in-law. 40:15 And all I heard was, she said, they shot dad, they shot dad. 40:21 And I could have heard this bastard screaming at the background, swearing at her, telling us he's a white dog and a white bitch and a white whatever. 40:35 And then everything went dead. 40:38 Phone was off. 40:40 I was 600 kilometers away. 40:46 My two daughters were there. 40:47 My youngest one was about three years old. 40:50 My son was there. One of my jockeys was there. 40:56 If Gavin wasn't a jockey and they didn't think he was a kid, they would have shot him as well. 41:02 The first thing they asked was, is there men in the house? 41:10 So they wanted to shoot my son's dog, a little Jack Russell. He had to take his shoelace and tie the horse, the dog's mouth closed. 41:25 So they tied him up and he managed to untie himself. 41:29 to get a pipe out of the cupboard to protect himself. But he couldn't break the pipe out. 41:36 I think the Lord saved him also like that. 41:38 So they heard him and while they were busy with Adele, they were walking up and down. 41:44 My father's room, they haven't shot him yet. 41:47 Adele said to me, the worst fear she ever had was, 42:03 I think my son was about 16 years old. 42:06 16 years old. 42:12 So they all said, they had the gun on his head and they don't know whether they would pull the tiger and shoot my son. 42:23 So eventually they went to my father's room. 42:26 My daughter, they closed the door and told her she must keep quiet. 42:33 When they opened the door, they must have been in the house before. 42:38 My son said he opened the door and then he took the pistol and hit the light switch on and when my father lifted up, he shot him in his stomach in front of my son. 42:52 Then they attacked my mother-in-law, threw off the bed. 42:59 my son got a handgun. He had to open the safe. He managed to hide the handgun. And he said to me, Dad, I could have shot him in his back when he walked out. But I didn't know who was with my mother and my sister. 43:16 If I fired a shot and they heard it, what would happen? 43:21 So luckily he didn't shoot the man. 43:28 it's another thing to get murdered, but it's a completely different thing to take somebody else's life. 43:38 This is not the way we are. 43:41 This is not who we are. 43:44 We are Christian people. 43:46 We don't take other people's lives. 43:48 We can protect ourselves, and that Malemamas know, and Rulf Mayer, and Ramaphosa. 43:56 You will push us and push us till something breaks. 44:03 We still got something to lose. That's in your advantage. 44:10 But so my youngest daughter started crying. 44:18 And Danielle had to cover her. 44:21 So can you imagine... 44:26 what a mother must feel like to go and lie over a kid that's three years old to protect her after they've raped her. 44:40 Everything about modern life is inherently distracting, and maybe that's on purpose. You won't think too deeply about enduring things, but whatever the cause, it's just a fact between the technology in your life and your job, it's hard to find time to slow down. 44:55 It's very hard to find time to pray. 44:59 Most of us know that we should pray, that it's probably the key thing that we do in life, but you try and what do you say? 45:06 You don't always know what to say, and that's why we love Hallow. Hallow is the best Christian prayer app there is. 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So wherever you are in your faith, literally wherever you are, Hallow can help you make prayer a more consistent part of your life. Download Hallow, H-A-L-L-O-W, today. It is the best. 46:09 And y'all did not tell them, we have to die with this type of striper. 46:17 Because she said, if it does get to a court case, they will humiliate her. This is the way the system works. 46:29 She did put in the affidavits that they pushed their hands into her and they touched all over. 46:43 So I drove back. 46:47 I found my one black farmer, farm worker that worked for me, Oderlug. 46:55 He said, he started working for me when I started farming. 47:03 Until today, he's still working for me. 47:06 He is like family and he is a brown person. 47:12 He's done more for me than any white person that I do know. So I phoned him, he packed my bags, baked me some tea, got me in the vehicle and phoned me after that every half an hour to make sure that I got there safe. 47:44 going past one of these small towns. I stopped at a church on a Sunday morning and I asked a priest there to pray for me. 47:55 I don't even know his name. If it wasn't for that, I wouldn't have been able to get back to the place I was just being. 48:03 So on that specific day, I probably drove like 12, 8, 20 hours nonstop. 48:12 Um... 48:15 I went through a toll gate on the way there. 48:22 I've been in the military and I've done, I did martial arts and there was nothing in the world that scared me. 48:31 I was so scared that I couldn't breathe. 48:40 When I drove through that toll gate, I was about 10, 15 kilometers away. 48:45 And it felt like the Lord was missing. He was not there anymore. 48:54 At the inside, I knew, I just knew it, that somebody would have been raped. That's the way they do it. 49:08 I got to the house. 49:08 My wife was standing outside. 49:12 I've said this many times, it looked like if you see a chicken that would stoot in the rain. 49:18 Adele looked like that. 49:21 So Adele's nickname in Afrikaans was Creek, this is an English cricket, because of her posture, because he was small, thin. 49:31 Now while After I put the phone down with my mother, I phoned a friend of mine, Wallace Stormay, and he got the police. 49:39 If it wasn't for that, I don't know what would have happened. But it took me a couple of minutes before my brain registered that I can phone somebody. 49:46 I got such a big fright that my brain was empty. 49:53 So when I got there and I saw my wife standing there, I didn't have any words. 50:00 You can't pray, you don't know what to do. 50:06 And at that moment, still you don't hate the way they hate us. 50:14 And if sovereignty means for this ANC government that they've been screaming this week, that my blood and my family's blood must flow for the poverty that is happening in South Africa, They must put that blame in front of the old national party, the Roofmeyer, the Evie de Clerks, Piet Kroekamp, Ramaphosa, Zuma, Malema. 50:46 They've been running this country for how many years now? 30 years. 50:50 Why do my wife have to be raped and my family being murdered so that they can... 51:00 have a party that I've got to pay for it by getting murdered because there's poverty. 51:10 And then they will say, you're getting murdered because you treat your farm workers badly. 51:18 It is the worst lie in the world. 51:26 If those farm workers are in the way, they will also shoot them. 51:30 like they do. 51:33 I want to state it again. 51:37 We are being murdered by another ethnic group. The Cape Flats and all the murders in the country that is not on white farmers. 51:46 That same ethnic group murder their own people. 51:50 We are not being murdered by our own white people. 51:53 We are being murdered by black people. 52:01 I don't know. I think they hate us because we've got farms. 52:08 Politically, they said that we stole everything from them. When I was in the military, I remember one of the points that the ANC made was to crash the economy because they said if they crash the economy and get the whole country unruly, they will stay in power. 52:30 And this is exactly what they're doing at the moment. They're crushing the whole economy because if you've got nowhere to go, they can stay in control forever. 52:41 They don't care if there's poverty. 52:44 But how can 30,000 people be to blame for the poverty of millions in this country? How can 30,000 people look after millions of people? 52:58 from Malawi, from Mozambique, from Zimbabwe, and from South Africa. 53:05 How is it possible? 53:07 Hey, it's Tucker Carlson. We launched ALP about a year and a half ago, and people are voracious for it. They can't get enough. Everywhere you go, you get the same question. When are you making more flavors? We are not in the business of disappointing people. Instead, we're in the business of satisfying them. So we have made at least three more flavors. Introducing the ALP Frontier Collection. They are Campfire Cinnamon, Sunset Mango, and Cowboy Coffee. Available in 4 milligram and 8 milligram. Because if you're going to use nicotine, you ought to have some options. Get the new Frontier Collection now at outpouch.com slash Tucker. 53:43 How productive are white farmers in South Africa? 53:48 I've sold fertilizer for Gavilon fertilizers in the US. I've been in the US when I worked for Gavilon. 53:57 I've been in many places in the world. In Australia, I haven't been to Europe. 54:04 But if you, I can't say in bushels, but if you're a South African farmer and you plant corn, the average farmer in South Africa on the center pivot, In the worst conditions that we've got, we'll harvest 16 tons average on corn. So we are productive farmers. 54:27 We buy all the taxes that come from the U.S. and wherever. 54:30 We're up to standard 80 tons of potatoes to 100 tons of potatoes. 54:37 On wheat, we also do 8 to 10 tons. 54:40 Soyers, we can do on the dry land areas, we can do 2 tons depending on the weather. 54:45 But we've got top, top farmers. 54:48 cattle production, we're up with the best in the world. 54:51 We don't have to stand back anywhere. 54:57 We're right up there, the best in the world. 55:00 Farmers in South Africa don't get subsidized like many farmers in other parts of the world do. 55:06 They've got to get their own finance, do their own thing. There's no help from the government at all. 55:14 They do block us that we can't import fertilizer directly. They've got all these rules and regulations that you can't import directly. 55:24 Does South Africa produce its own fertilizer? We used to be self-sufficient in fertilizing totally, in total. 55:31 At the moment, we're not. The sassel that we had is not producing fertilizer anymore. It's been taken over by the government. We had a phosphorus plant in... 55:43 Palabalva that went to Rich's Bay. 55:46 They didn't produce any granule this season so far. Nothing. They'd be standing for six months. We've got to import everything. 55:53 We're on a massive strain at the moment with the wars that's going around. We can't get fertilizer. Vessels has got to come from Russia and all over. 56:01 So still with all that, farmers are still producing. 56:05 We're getting murdered. We're having everything against us from the outside world. 56:10 And we are still producing. 56:12 We are still there. 56:14 But South Africa was once self-sufficient in fertilizer? Total. 56:19 Totally. We were self-sufficient in everything except urea. It was always cheaper to import urea than to manufacture it ourselves. 56:30 But the government in 30 years has destroyed the entire industry. There's nothing left. 56:35 There is nothing left. 56:38 That's horrifying. 56:40 So why do you think it is the farmers, though, the 30,000 mostly, well, white, but a lot of them Afrikaans-speaking farmers, why are they the targets of this violence when they're such a small percentage of the white population? 56:59 I think the ANC government is using it. 57:03 They've got to tell uneducated people that we are to blame. 57:08 for their poverty. 57:12 And they managed to get that over. Those people think we are to blame for their poverty. 57:17 If you drive a car, they would think that car actually belongs to them. 57:25 They destroyed our schools. 57:28 They destroyed our hospitals. There's no hospitals in the small towns left anymore. 57:33 Really? It looks like peak stars. You can't go there. There's no hospitals. When my wife got sick, I had to drive 800 kilometers to the nearest hospitals and 350. If you get a heart attack and there's no helicopter taking you, you're not going to make it. 57:48 There is no hospitals left. There's no doctors left. People are just leaving. 57:54 What would happen if you, what's the nearest hospital to your farm? 57:58 My nearest is either Bloemfontein, it's 350 kilometers away, or Port Elizabeth, 350 kilometers away. And if that, if those hospitals doesn't have space, then you go to Cape Town. How far is that? 890 kilometers away from me. 58:11 So I've done that trip for three and a half years after the murder. 58:16 Every two months. 58:19 Why did you go every two months? 58:22 So, you know, 58:28 After the murder, first my mother-in-law got cancer and she passed away. 58:39 And very soon after the murder, I could see my wife was getting sick. 58:54 She did test HIV. 58:58 And luckily she didn't have HIV. 59:06 But she got, first she was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis, then leukemia. 59:14 And the last two months of her life, she was also diagnosed with fibromyalgia. 59:19 And if you go back on the science of these diseases, fear and anxiety extreme fear and anxiety is a definite cause of these diseases as is diabetes a friend of mine sean was attacked while they were asleep and stabbed and sean has got diabetes now he was stabbed while he was asleep yeah they walked into his house tied them up him and his wife and started stabbing him while he didn't wake up at first Shell was awake, tied her up, put socks in her mouth, tied them up so that they quiet and then just started stabbing him. 60:06 They won't ask questions. If they walk in, if you're a man, they will kill you because they've got to get you out the way. 60:14 Did they stab his wife? 60:16 No, luckily not. 60:25 So after the murder, we waited for four days for forensic to eventually pitch up to take fingerprints. 60:37 In that time, my kids are there. 60:44 There's animals on the outside that you've got to look after that's got to be fed and watered. 60:51 And then you've got to wait for forensic to hopefully... 60:55 They get some fingerprints, this or that. In the meantime, you can't clean the blood that's everywhere. 61:02 Kids just had to walk over that. 61:05 You can't fix these kids again. 61:09 You can't get them to be normal again. 61:14 When I was 17 years old, when I went to the military, I didn't experience this that we are experiencing now. 61:22 We had a proper military force in South Africa. We could look after ourselves. 61:28 But I have never experienced what I'm experiencing now. 61:35 You can go for psychiatry treatment and this and that. 61:39 They can pray for you. 61:42 You can pray for yourself. 61:45 And after that, you will see on social media or hear that somebody will phone you and say there's another murder there. They don't put it in the news anymore. 61:56 They hide it. Nobody talks about it. 62:00 The people near you will talk about it and then somebody else will just hope it doesn't happen to you and then you'll get on social media. 62:11 Statistical-wise, we don't murder you because in the Cape Flats, there's hundreds of kids being murdered coming back to the same thing again. 62:21 the same ethnic group that murdered them. 62:23 They're not murdered by whites. 62:24 No, by their own people. 62:29 But so then, we waited for four days. 62:36 After that, I had to go to a state mortuary. 62:44 I think in the US, if there's a murder, there's a specific mortuary where They investigate those murders and those bodies go to. 62:58 In South Africa now, the state morgeries are in the locations. That's in any case where I had to go to, in Sebu King. 63:08 I had to drive 10 kilometers into that location where it's definitely not safe if you're white. 63:16 It's not a place where you want to be. 63:18 They will murder you if you're driving there. You cannot stop. 63:23 you've got to go and get there and get out. 63:28 So when I eventually got there, there was a sign on the wall there. 63:37 And I was sitting there crying and on that sign it said, no bodies will be kept here for longer than three months. 63:50 which Ramaphosa and Louv Mayer will tell me that I'm telling a lie now. 63:57 And I couldn't understand what I was reading because I was crying and I was afraid and I was emotionally, I was drained. 64:08 They made me sat there for two hours, maybe longer, before I could witness the body. 64:15 Because you must say, this is... 64:19 who the person is, sign all the documents. 64:27 So eventually, a black man came. He had chewing gum chewing it. 64:35 And he fell back in a chair on the other side of a counter. 64:39 And he was leaning backwards like this as he was on the beach. 64:44 And he blew this bubble with the chewing gum. 64:48 In the meantime, they were talking and laughing. I don't know what jokes they were talking, whether they were talking about me or whatever they were doing, I don't know. It's very disrespectful. If you haven't experienced racism, go there and tell me if you haven't experienced racism. 65:04 So when that bubble burst, he said to me, so what happened to the deceased? 65:13 I was never treated so disrespectful in my life. 65:19 So after massive conflict with that, we eventually walked to the body. And I remember the guy from Doves that had to move all the dead bodies. 65:36 I looked at him and I said to him, does the Lord really exist? 65:44 And he said to me, yes. Yes. 65:47 I said, how is that possible? Because you see this every day. 65:51 And he said to me, this what you see here is not the Lord, it is Satan. 66:02 And I'd be ashamed of saying it. 66:05 While I was sitting there, I was looking down at him and I thought to myself, how can you do a job like this? 66:10 Why didn't you rather go to university or college or study something? How can you do something like this? 66:16 Without those people, I do not know what we will do in South Africa. 66:23 And I've got to take hats off to them. 66:27 So he stood up and he said to me, if you're not scared of bodies, or if you are scared of bodies, then just look at the back of my head. 66:37 Do not look to the side. 66:43 So the norm in South Africa is that those state morgeries, refrigerators don't even work. 66:51 There's too many bodies in any case. There's no space for them. They don't come and pick up the bodies. 66:57 And that is black people. 67:00 Because Zimbabweans, Malawis, whoever is here, they don't pick up the dead. 67:09 They just leave them there. 67:11 So by law, I think they must keep them there for three months. 67:16 So while I was there, there was not enough space for those dead bodies. 67:19 Why don't they pick up their bodies of their people? 67:22 It's cheaper. It's too expensive. 67:25 So just leave them there. 67:29 And that's poverty. And that's got to be blame on me because I'm a white farmer. 67:37 So the bodies were lying. 67:38 That's not just poverty. Some of the poorest people in the world pick up the bodies of their dead. Doesn't happen in South Africa. 67:45 There's something else there. That's disgusting. 67:49 So the bodies were lying. I went through a passage and we turned. And it was bodies. I walked through the middle of the bodies. The bodies were lying on both sides. And they had these blue covers halfway over the bodies. They were out close. 68:05 So as they... 68:09 were heating up or I don't know what they were doing, they would swap them around, put them in the refrigerator and turn them around. 68:18 So my father was lying on the table there without any clothes. 68:28 The fear in his face was still there. 68:35 I'm not scared of a dead body. 68:39 But what I saw was horrific. 68:42 My brother fell with a motorbike and I went through the same story. 68:49 My brother had long hair, died in a motorbike and not in a murder, just a normal accident, but all his hair got shaved off. They cut him open in his head and they put stitches in that far apart. 69:00 I can do a barbed wire fencing better than what they do. 69:04 My question to them is, if you put on the death certificate, cause of death on natural causes, why the hell do you have to cut the bodies up and do any forensic investigation on it in any case? 69:19 You don't open a case of murder, so why do you cut those bodies open? 69:25 Why don't we have a say? 69:28 my father was his beard was long the blood was in his mouth on his cheeks in his nose um they cut him open from the bottom all the way to here and the stitches were i don't know five centimeters apart look absolutely horrific and disrespectful why 69:57 do I have to go to a state mortuary to witness a body, to be treated like an animal and then move the body to a proper place where we can bury, where we can put the dead away. 70:21 If my wife or my daughter or my son had to go there, and witness a dead body. 70:33 Adi, I would probably have died sooner. 70:54 Then after you sign those documentation, then you've gotta go and get a date certificate. 71:07 You get to internal affairs, you stand in a queue all day long. 71:14 There's not one white person working there, there's only black people working there. 71:17 You stand in a queue to get anything, you get IDZ, I don't know what else you get there. 71:25 And you cry and everybody look at you like you're an idiot. 71:30 standing in a queue crying. 71:33 And when you eventually get to the front, they come back with a death certificate and say, cause of death, unnatural causes. 71:42 I torn mine up. 71:44 And I said, I will not accept this. 71:47 The police arrived again. 71:51 Massive conflict. 71:53 And eventually I got this death certificate that says, can't shoot into abdomen. 72:04 We've got a farmer's organization called AgriSA. 72:09 It is the only agricultural organization that the government accepts as a spokesperson. Call it a spokesperson. 72:21 I've mentioned this to them many, many years back. 72:24 Our own organization has never stood up for one farm murder. 72:32 I've personally spoken to top management at that stage Dan Creek. 72:40 They did nothing. 72:42 They just hide these test certificates under the table. Nobody come back to me and say, you're wrong, you're right, nothing. 72:51 So I've got pictures of it, I can show it, I can prove it. 72:57 We had a spike of farmers, I think around about 2010, 2007, don't take me on it, but all of a sudden, those death certificates, when it used to say bullet wound or whatever it used to say, it now changed. 73:14 So I think Ramaphosa is doing the biggest fraud in the world, first of all, with the death certificates. And don't tell me, the ambassador here in the US, Mr. Roof Mayer doesn't know that. 73:26 because he was part of the government reporting to the president, Mr. Evy de Klerk at that stage. 73:34 He must have known all this, and he must still know it. 73:42 If you've gone through all that, then first of all, they don't investigate the murder. 73:53 If they do investigate it, the docket at the police station will go missing. 74:00 It will just disappear. 74:03 You've got no say over it. 74:07 If they do catch somebody, like this one, Mario Konzo, that murdered my father-in-law. 74:16 He murdered 23 people. 74:20 He got a life sentence of 146 years. We went through that whole ordeal. 74:26 So when you get to court, I just studied agriculture. So I'm not an attorney, I'm not an advocate. 74:34 I'm not a politician. I'm a normal person. 74:38 I battle to pay my accounts like any other normal person. 74:47 But my farm workers are being sorted. They live, they eat. 74:53 I will not feed somebody like Roof Meijer and Piet Kroekamp in South Africa that is white. 74:59 I will rather feed a black person, not Malema. 75:06 We are not all racist, black and white people. 75:09 I can't be blamed for what's happening in the Cape Flats. You are murdering your own people. I'm standing up for myself, for my own people, for my own family. 75:22 I have been in three attacks. 75:28 We survived the first two. 75:30 Nobody got killed. 75:34 Is that how you got the scar on your chin? 75:37 That's one of them, yeah. What happened? 75:42 They were slaughting cattle and walked onto them and they saw me and said I was going to report them. They had to kill me. 75:49 They were slaughtering your cattle? 75:50 My grandfather's cattle. 75:55 They tried to slit my throat, fought back, I've got a scar on my leg, scar on the side. That one was actually okay. 76:05 The other one, they came onto my grandfather's farm, said they wanted to buy sheep. 76:14 My grandfather, we immediately saw that there was trouble. 76:18 My wife was there with me, we didn't have kids yet. 76:22 My grandfather sent my wife into the house and said she must put the lights off, open the dogs, something like that. 76:29 At first, she didn't register. 76:32 And when she got it, she went into the house, opened the safe, got the guns out. 76:37 I went in the other way around the house, my grandfather stood there. 76:41 And when we got inside, the next minute, it was a taxi full of people. They came out with the AK-47s and just started shooting at us. 76:50 So my grandfather came through the kitchen door and we fired back. 76:57 We found the police. 76:59 They came there, no forensic investigation, nothing. 77:04 And nothing happened of it afterwards. 77:06 Why did they start firing an AK-47 at you? 77:09 No idea. 77:11 We didn't have any sheep to sell. 77:13 Did you know these people? No. Had you ever seen them before? 77:18 the same ones that murdered my father. I've never seen them ever before. 77:22 So in court, this Mario Konzo was caught, and the court had said that there was eight people outside, six people. So when you're in a farm murder, you've got all these burglar proofing outside. 77:33 Yes. 77:34 All the steel fences, all the barbed wire to keep people out. But you're in the house, you're stuck in your own house, you can't get out. 77:40 Yes. 77:42 Yeah. 77:46 But you don't, I mean, to drive to a stranger's house and open fire with an AK-47 for no reason is a strange thing to do. 77:53 Same what they did when they murdered my father-in-law. This is what they do. They dive past and see there's a soft target and they just go in. 78:00 Did they steal a lot of things? They don't come to steal. They come to take guns and murder and take vehicles. 78:08 They don't steal anything. There's no theft involved here. 78:13 They just want to kill the whites. So the second attack, I came back from work, stopped in front of the farm gate, and here was this black man standing in front of the gate with racehorse bridles, racing bridles. 78:28 Those racehorse racing bridles are very expensive. 78:32 Aluminium, alumite shoes, horses, a whole lot of things. They wanted to sell it to me. 78:40 So I phoned a policeman, and I said, there's a man standing in front of my gate, and it looks like he wants to sell me stolen goods. 78:47 So they said to me, I must bring him into town to Kimberley. 78:51 They will give me money. 78:53 There's a bar there, the Horshu Hotel. I must stop there. They will wait for me there. I must keep this man in the car. 79:02 Walk in, they will give me money. 79:04 There will be police in a car park right next to me. 79:07 So it worked 100%. Police were standing outside, they didn't look like policemen, also black people. 79:14 Got out, they gave me the money and I offered him the money. 79:17 And when he took the money, they arrested him. 79:21 So that was it, one thief less. 79:25 But he escaped and he came back. 79:29 with my barn and light. 79:31 He set your barn on fire? My tactics burned down. Some of my tactics, my equipment, I had alfalfa bales there that burned down. 79:41 And as it is, you're always under-insured when things like that happen. 79:45 I think I lost about 1.3, 1.4 million land at that stage, which was from my pocket. 79:52 Met up with my wife in the house with guns, took my guns. 79:58 It took me months to get my guns back. 80:01 Eventually, they caught him again, got my firearms with him, and he escaped again. And he's still at large still today. 80:09 They never caught him. I was treated like a criminal because my guns got missing. They wanted to cancel my firearm licenses and all that. 80:18 It sounds like if strangers are pulling up with AK-47s that it's easy to get a gun in South Africa. 80:26 The only people that's got to have a license is us. Whites. Yeah. 80:32 A license for a firearm. The rest is AK-47s. We're not allowed to have automatic rifles or weapons with us. 80:40 You've got to have a special license to get something like that. 80:44 You don't have AK-47s? No, we can't. We can't have that on your... 80:47 There is people that does have, but there's special reasons why you'll have something like that. So handgun is there. 80:56 and a hunting rifle, single shot guns. 80:59 But other than that, no. 81:01 Wait, so you've been the victim of three farm attacks. They tried to cut your throat. They attacked your wife. They murdered your father-in-law in front of your kids, but you can't have an AK-47, but they do. 81:14 Yeah. No, you're not allowed. That sounds like America. So if you, if you, look, I don't want to shoot anybody. 81:26 If you do shoot one of those intruders, I can guarantee you a million percent that I will be in jail first. 81:38 In your house? In my own house. I can guarantee you that I will sit in jail. So you don't want to shoot them. You don't even want to point a gun at them. 81:48 Then you're in big trouble. So they are trying to disarm us now. 81:55 How is this not ethnic cleansing? 81:59 It sounds like ethnic cleansing to me. If you take one group of people on the basis of the race and say you can't defend yourself and they tell everyone else you can rape their wives and murder them, that sounds like ethnic cleansing. 82:09 It's all blamed on the poverty that was caused by me and my friend, Mr. Jan van Riebeek, when he came in in 1625. 82:19 So I don't know how I was communicating with him, probably by WhatsApp, telling him that we are going to destroy South Africa. 82:27 We are going to steal everything. 82:32 I haven't got the answer for that. They're trying to disarm us now, like 100%, to take all our firearms away from us, that we can't have licenses. 82:46 They're trying their utmost best to disarm us. 82:49 because they are worried that we are going to defend ourselves. 82:52 We cannot go and defend. You cannot fight an AK-47 with a nine millimeter pistol. No, you can't. That is impossible. 83:02 And there is not one farmer in South Africa that wants to murder and shoot people. There's not one of us. 83:11 Why would we do that? 83:13 We need each other. We need to carry on. All we want to do in South Africa is be at your own business and carry on. Why can't we be safe? Why murder us for the poverty that you as the ANC has caused? 83:31 How can I be blamed for the poverty? You said you don't want to shoot anyone. You're a Christian. You don't want to harm other people. And I believe you. How do you think the people who shot your father-in-law felt? Do you think they felt bad about it? 83:47 I don't think they'd even get nightmares of it. 83:51 How can you murder 23 people and sit and smile when you get to the courtroom? Look me in the eye and grin and provoke me in such a way that I think I'm going to get a heart attack. 84:03 He did that to you? The man who raped your wife and shot your father-in-law? 84:06 Looked at me and smiled at me and other people were sitting next to him. They only caught one of eight. 84:13 So when you go to court, these people... 84:16 can pick an attorney or an advocate, or it's one that's being provided to them. 84:22 I've got to sit with a state prosecutor that's there on the day. 84:26 So we went to court years after the murder was committed. 84:30 I don't know how many years, three, four. 84:33 So the state prosecutor was a white man. The man that was representing the murderer was also white. 84:42 The guy on the bench was a white guy. 84:47 So we don't have a jury in South Africa in courtrooms. 84:53 The judge decides by himself. 84:55 The judges are employed by the president. 85:01 So they employ their own judges. 85:05 We've got no say about that. 85:09 So I've got to go to court, except the state prosecutor that's there. 85:16 This specific man came. He smelled of alcohol. He was sweating. He was late. 85:23 And that whole thing that you put over, I don't know what you call it even. 85:30 He ran into an empty courtroom and he said to me, wife, please tell me what happened at the murder for three, four minutes. 85:37 Then we walked to court for three days. 85:42 They took my wife apart inside. 85:46 At one stage, the guy that was representing the white man that's representing this murder wanted to know what they've done to her. 85:57 And she only committed rape to me like three, four years after that. 86:02 In the meantime, she had an HIV test with nobody knowing, waiting if it's positive or not. 86:17 And you go through that whole thing in court so that this man can tell you, you're a liar. 86:26 You get found guilty. 86:29 I witnessed the body. 86:32 I got the death certificate. 86:35 We go to court. 86:37 You know how many years of my life I've lost? 86:41 Being scared. 86:44 sitting next to a kitchen table that you can't even talk. 86:48 You can't say anything. 86:51 All that's in your head and your mind is what happened to you. 86:56 And then this white attorney will tell my wife in court that she's lying. 87:02 And if everything is finished and he gets a sentence of 146 years, he gets released after a year. 87:08 They are telling me now he died. They can't prove anything to me. 87:24 So my wife got sick. 87:29 We got to a professor in Cape Town. 87:32 They all agreed that the disease is because of the intense fear that she had experienced. 87:41 Her fingernails started losing from the front to the back. 87:52 All dead of them. 87:55 that she was in so much pain that she couldn't clean herself when she went to a toilet. 88:04 The humiliation in that for a woman, that if she had to use her hair dryer to blow her hair after she's washed them, the ones that's left, of all the pain because her fingernails are losing because of these diseases. 88:31 I cannot take my wife. I couldn't take her to a hospital where I live. 88:36 There is no hospital left. 88:40 The closest one that I could help her was in Cape Town. 88:43 I went there for three and a half years, maybe more. 88:51 At one stage we stayed there for six months and she did treatment. 89:00 She gets chemo. 89:01 There's a thing that if you don't have white blood cells that you inject that I had to inject her around your navel called Grastiva I think. 89:18 And rand-wise, it's 1,500 rand in injection so that your body can make white blood cells so that you have an immune system. 89:31 My medical aid didn't pay for that. I had a hospital plan. The government doesn't pay that. 89:38 I had to pay 60,000 rand a month. 89:42 I don't know how long to pay for that. 89:47 five injections a week, only Saturdays and Sundays not. 89:52 That causes your bone marrow to expand. 90:02 You got allergic to morphine. 90:04 No normal person can live that long. 90:08 And be on painkillers and your liver and your kidneys last. 90:14 Of all the chemo and chemo tablets and everything you drink. 90:27 But I came with those injections. 90:32 Four hours after that, your bone marrow expands and then she's in so much pain. 90:37 And there's nothing I could do for Bernardo. 90:42 These tablets that you dissolve in water, that was the only thing that worked. I had trays full of that. 90:52 And I'm not a medical doctor. I had to inject her myself. 90:57 And to bring that bloody thing there to know how much pain she's going to be in four hours after that. 91:13 And then Saturday she's better, Sunday she's okay, she walks, she laughs, she tries to cook, visit the kids. 91:22 Monday morning, nine o'clock, I've got to give that injection all over again. 91:30 I spent thousands of hands to try and keep my wife comfortable. 91:38 If you had treatment for leukemia and all that and you've got to drive back home 800 kilometers. 91:47 When we had this country, we had a hospital so you couldn't drive in your own town. 91:55 Two kilometers and you were at a hospital, somebody would have treated you. 92:00 What happened to that hospital? 92:02 The hospitals just got destroyed by the ANC government. There's no hospitals anymore. 92:07 There is just no hospitals. It looks like pigsty. You can't go there. 92:14 I invite anybody to go to these small towns in between Johannesburg, Turban, and those places. 92:22 Go there and see what happens. 92:25 See if you're a patient and you would be treated. 92:30 Please, no hospitals left. Ramaphosa, all these hospitals are gone. 92:35 So then I had to drive her all the way back home. 92:40 All the expenses are for me. 92:43 They murder us. They rape our wives. 92:47 My daughter had to go through psychiatrist treatment. 92:52 When a kid is 15 years old and book herself into a hospital hospital, where they try and fix your head by yourself. You must know a kid is in trouble. 93:07 And she phoned me and said, Dad, I'm here now. I can't live for myself any longer. 93:15 She didn't commit suicide. 93:18 She wrote a book with poems in her. 93:22 You read that thing. And it's your own kid. You can't do anything but cry. 93:33 then the whole world comes back and say, you lying, you racist bastards, you murdering the black people. That's why they murder you. 93:43 They do say that too. That's what the American media says. 93:46 They say that all over the world. 93:49 If you go back to the death certificates, if you go back to the investigations, that does not happen. 93:55 We cannot prove that we are getting murdered. 93:58 There is a genocide going on. 94:01 If there's 25,000 or 30,000 of us left, how many more can they murder? 94:09 Any family in South Africa has got people, family that works overseas or lives or immigrated to Australia, America, New Zealand, or England. 94:20 I don't know of anybody that hasn't got family that's been in another country. 94:25 Are you going to stay? I've got to stay. My kids doesn't want to go. It's a beautiful country. We're trying to fix. We need solutions. We need help. 94:34 What the solution is, I don't know. 94:37 But, I mean, the intent, obviously, is to kill you or force you to leave. 94:45 I think we'll probably see it out until they start taking... 94:52 taking the farms, taking our property, and then your own agricultural organization, AgriSA, is negotiating with the ANC government on my behalf of my own property that I worked and paid for without my permission. 95:14 What do you mean negotiate? What is there to negotiate? 95:16 They are setting the rules how they can take these farms away. Which farms must be taken? 95:23 They started that long ago. 95:25 What is the criteria that they can take your farm away? And then they come back and say, no, it's not that bad. 95:32 They won't just take your farm. They can take anything they want. 95:37 It's been written in the law books. 95:40 They can take my car away if they want, without compensation. 95:45 We're going the same route as Zimbabwe. 95:48 But we've got to stand up. 95:51 and try and save something. 95:55 If I can save one daughter and one wife from being raped or to go through witness a body, go to court, if we can pick our own attorneys and our own advocates for the government to pay, then I'll get somewhere. 96:17 It doesn't sound like you can persuade them. I mean, anyone who would allow this to happen is evil and isn't open to reason or negotiation. 96:32 Look, since the military, what I was taught is they are not negotiable. They are not, it's impossible to negotiate with them. 96:48 They ran to Russia when there was an apartheid system in place. 96:55 They ran to Russia, to Lebanon and wherever, where did they run to? 97:01 Probably Iran also. 97:06 We've got nowhere to run. 97:11 If I can plead with the United States government, whoever they will be, I don't care. 97:16 I've got to stand up for my own family. I cannot stand up for the Cape Flats or for whoever. 97:24 We've got into a situation that I've got to stand up for my own family. 97:27 It came as close as that. I've got to stand up for my own kids, my own grandchildren around me like that. 97:35 It sounds like you will. 97:38 I made that decision already. 97:41 I've lost... 97:44 the love of my life that I was beaten with for 37 years. 97:52 My old family has been destroyed. This has stolen like 10 years of my life. 97:59 When I started chewing horses, I was so excited when I put the first money down to buy a farm. I cannot explain this to you. 98:10 When I had 10 goats and five sheep, was the best thing in the world that happened to me. 98:20 I've built it up in such a way that we can live. 98:24 And I've got to give it away for free. 98:28 They tell me I stole it. 98:32 And because there's sovereignty in this government and they can make laws to punish Jan van Riebeek... 98:40 I keep on coming back to the same thing because the intelligence that's in this government is of such that that's the only thing they've got. 98:51 I cannot be blamed for the poverty that's there. 98:55 That's not my doing. 98:57 I'm making a contribution, as is all my fellow farmers in South Africa, towards poverty. But we cannot... 99:07 look after the millions that's coming as illegal immigrants into this country. 99:13 That is the government's job, not us. 99:17 And from taking my farm away and murdering me is not going to solve the problem. 99:23 Malema can scream whatever he wants. He's got no brains at all or any intelligence. 99:29 to plant corn tomorrow morning or to farm with cattle or do whatever is. They will die of hunger if we are not there. 99:38 They will. 99:40 So it, over all of this is a government and a judicial system that is ignoring what's happening. Judges seem to refuse to bring any of the perpetrators to justice. Who appoints the judges? 99:57 So look, I'm not a, I'm not a state president or something, but the state president has got the say, and Malema is also on this board or whatever that decides. Julius Malema. Who the judges will be. 100:14 So for people who don't follow South African politics, Julius Malema has been the head of something called the Economic Freedom Fighters, correct? 100:20 Yeah, he's the head of the Economic Freedom Fighters. He's the one that sings the song, Kill the Boer, Kill the Farmer. 100:25 Yes, he is kind of Al Sharpton of... 100:29 South Africa, open racist, open anti-white racist, calling for violence against whites, but he has been portrayed as an opponent of the ANC, the ruling party. 100:40 But how is he appointing judges? 100:44 I think Malema, my personal opinion is Malema is just a front. 100:50 Malema is... 100:52 Heart and soul working for Ramaphosa. For the ANC. Yeah, heart and soul. I mean, everything points to it. 100:59 Yeah, it seems obvious even from here watching. 101:03 I was lucky enough that I was in a proper school and I was at university when it was still there. 101:10 Although I studied agriculture, I don't think I'm that brain dead that I can't see it. Yes. 101:18 There's an attorney in Cape Town, Millie Wesley, that's found him guilty on hate speech, they've gone to court the other day again. He's supposed to be in jail. 101:32 Nothing is happening to him. 101:35 He's been found guilty of firing off the firearm where 80, 90,000 people were sitting in public. 101:46 He's not in jail. 101:50 If I point a water pistol that I buy from the local shop where they sell bread that kids play with, that will be plastic and neon green in color. 102:05 If I point that play gun at you, you will end up in jail. 102:14 I know this because my son-in-law played with an air gun with a man of color. 102:24 a BB gun and unfortunately pushed his limits and shot the man on his leg. 102:33 He almost, he ended up almost in jail. He got a fine of a hundred thousand rand and a suspension on his job for six months. 102:51 and read that he was found guilty of pointing a firearm. 102:57 A BB gun that keeps playing with. 103:00 Malema can fire off an automatic rifle in public. They found him guilty of that. 103:11 Nothing happens to him. 103:15 If Malema would ever become the president of South Africa, you will see blood flow like you've never seen. 103:26 You will never ever see a bigger dictator than him. 103:30 The biggest question is always, they start with you running to America. 103:42 We can sort out our own problems. 103:47 How can we sort out your own problems? 103:50 How many times did we speak to this government? How many times did you pray? The court doesn't even help you. How can you sort out your own problems and be sovereign like this new president came here over the weekend? When did he come here? Did he come here, the one in South Africa, that says there must not be sanctions against their visums? 104:16 How is that possible? 104:19 that they can judge themselves the right to have people murdered all the time. 104:27 Stand in front of the whole world and sing, kill the boer, kill the farmer. 104:33 Fire off a rifle. 104:37 You employ the judges, you, the Julius Malema, with Ramaphosa. 104:43 He's on the board. 104:47 Nothing happens to you. 104:50 There's no statistics. It doesn't make sense at all. I mean, how is this possible? The only way that we can stop this is these politicians cannot have all the power. 105:05 They cannot have all the power. 105:07 The only way we will survive is somewhere along the line. There's got to be self-governance. 105:15 Like we've got a place there called Orania. 105:18 It's people that's got a normal farm on the other side of Hopetown in the Northern Cape that started and made a massive success of this farm. 105:29 Now the ANC and Malema is going for them all the way because it's racist. 105:36 These are people who've destroyed every institution in your country, from the power grid to the schools to the hospitals, governance itself, the courts. None of it works. The murder rate's out of control. The rape rate is the highest on the planet. And now they're murdering Afrikaans-speaking peoples and stealing their farms. 105:54 So on what basis can they say you don't have a right to have your own community? I don't understand. 106:03 I can't answer you on that also. 106:06 It does sound kind of familiar as an American, I have to say. 106:10 All I know is at one point, my family's blood can't flow for the sake of Jan van Liebeek and the poverty in the country. 106:27 I can promise you, if we were governing that place, the poverty would have been not like it is now. No. 106:34 But I can't be blamed for that. But I don't want to be a state president. All I want to be is I want to be a farmer. 106:42 As an agronomist, I can make a contribution to my fellow farmers. 106:49 Because, I come back to that, we do have the best farmers in the world. 106:56 We are Christian people. 107:02 And our farmers has got integrity. 107:05 To be still farming in South Africa, if you don't have integrity, you can't produce food because financially we don't get anything. 107:17 You've got to do everything by yourself. 107:20 To harvest 16 and 18 tons of corn, 8 tons of wheat or 10 tons of wheat, 80 between 200 tons of potatoes. 107:32 On citrus, I can't, I don't know the facts. I'm not a, I don't have the knowledge about trees and all that, but how can they not see that the South African farmer is making a contribution to South Africa? 107:51 Well, of course they can see it, and that's why they hate you. 107:55 Godspeed. Ms. Lotz, thank you very much for spending all this time and for recounting what you did. 108:02 It's been a privilege, and we do appreciate it. 108:08 And on behalf of the whole of South Africa and even the people in the Cape Flats that's getting murdered, I do wish it could have been different. 108:29 You don't know how we wish that we can just live in peace together. 108:36 There's enough farms for everybody to buy. 108:39 Buy them and farm them. 108:41 The government has got enough money. 108:45 We've got enough knowledge as white farmers to set people up and start farming. 108:53 But not for free. 108:57 We didn't come here for free. 108:59 We're not going for free. 109:03 God bless you. 109:04 Thank you very much, sir.